nitrodann

This thread is almost the only sign of what's happening over here in Australia. The whole western world will go through this in my lifetime, I only hope we here will be a strong as your people.

Much respect to all of you, godspeed.

Dann

Scrappy Jack

iTrader: (2)

Stay safe, Hakan.


BBC News - Turkish government says it may use army to end protests
BBC Q&A: BBC News - Q&A: Protests in Turkey

Counter-points from Erdogan supporters: BBC News - Turkish voices back Erdogan against protests

Ryan_G

iTrader: (8)

I foresee a lot more violence in Turkey. The excessive brutality of the govt. seems to be making it worse and turning a lot more people against Erdogan that would normally be neutral.

Godless Commie

iTrader: (2)

Some dingdong among the paid crowds - forced to attend the PM's rally on Sunday proudly proclaimed she's Recep Tayyip Erdogan's dingleberry, on live TV!

Goes to show how political, bright, astute and wise sheeple can be.

(I'm safe, and doing well, btw)

sixshooter

iTrader: (12)

Good.

You are our light to what is going on inside Turkey. This is an historic time, so take a few pictures.

I love individual liberty and detest government tyranny. And I generally like to support the underdog being faced with overwhelming odds. We are with you in spirit.

Braineack

iTrader: (62)

I like shirts too.

Ryan_G

iTrader: (8)

I am interested to see if the PM is stupid enough to try and use the military to stomp out the protestors. Due to the fact that much of the military is still secular and everyone has to serve a small stint in the military at some point I have a feeling it would lead to split forces and a possible civil war. This could get really ugly really fast if military force is used.

Braineack

iTrader: (62)

I could see the PM kicking out of native Turks from the country, importing muslims in their stead and giving them all access to healthcare, a living wage without a job, and a newly vacant house.

Scrappy Jack

iTrader: (2)

I don't think you understand the situation at all. I am not sure my grasp is much better, but my impression is that - if anything - the current ruling party is perceived to be closer in alignment with the perception of the American "Religious Right" in that they prefer conservative social stances, are okay letting their religious views influence policy decisions, and promote capitalism (including the crony kind) over social and environmental issues.

Meanwhile, my perception of the protestors is that they are an interesting hybrid of secular leftists who want to resist the (corrupt) commercialization of public spaces and who feel a resentment toward their perception of a breakdown in the separation of church and state.

In simpler terms, imagine if G.W. Bush was as religious and mean as MSNBC thought he was and the Occupy Wall Street gang was cleaner and gainfully employed.
It will be interesting to monitor but remember that we are getting only heavily biased sides of the story: that from vigorous Erdogan supporters and that from vigorous Erdogan opponents. There is almost no one with good access pretending to try to be objective (aka news media). The BBC seems to be the best source I've found so far.

I understand Hakan's view that the most recent elections, in which Erdogan's party won, were suspect. That said, he seems to still have the support of a significant portion of the population and many may not sympathize with the protestors as much as you might think.

Ryan_G

iTrader: (8)

I would agree that there is a very significant part of the population that does not sympathize with the protestors currently. However, when a govt. starts using military force to extinguish the voices of its own people attitudes start to change. You would also essentially be pitting some military members against parts of their own family. Some will inevitably defect and fight with the protestors in the event of lethal force being used. This kind of event has a way of escalating quickly and unless the PM has an incredibly loyal military it could end very badly for him. As far as I understand he "purged" many of the high ranking generals that disagreed with him already but much of the lower/middle ranking officers and units are still very secular and do not like the ruling party very much.

Braineack

iTrader: (62)

I think I clearly grasped it in post 34. Now I'm into hyperbole.

Rafa

iTrader: (22)

godless commie,

I've been reading this thread with interest and I just read a report on one of the Spanish newspapers that concerned me: Erdogan planea restringir las redes sociales para evitar provocaciones - ABC.es

I'm going to translate the basics: Erdogan is considering the possibility of restricting the use of social media (twitter and facebook).

It sure doesn't say much about his concept of democracy.

Sorry man.

Keep safe.

Braineack

iTrader: (62)

He's doing it because the regular news outlet wont report and all my turk friends are posting on facebook and alike to pass the news back to Turkey so they know what is actually going on.

Godless Commie

iTrader: (2)

About 20,000 people gathered peacefully to leave carnations in Taksim square in memory of those who died during the "resistance movement" since May 31.
Police responded with a brutal attack, initiated by water cannons (laced with chemicals), tear gas grenades, and clubbed people senseless.
The PM, meanwhile keeps fanning the flames.
At a rally today, he said he wants the Gezi Park cleared, so "his citizens" can go and enjoy the place.
People all agree his days are numbered.

"Everyday I am Chapuling"

https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...w=1920&bih=993

Joe Perez

iTrader: (8)

I come from a long family history of civil disobedience. The Spanish civil war, the communist revolution in Cuba... My ancestors bravely packed up and ran away from each one.

Watching episodes like this unfold make me sort of vaguely uneasy with a hint of familial nostalgia... As though I feel I ought to be bravely packing up and running away from it. And yet I have never found myself in such a position. It seems that in the US, our various regional and federal governments are literally too big (and too smart) to fail.

sixshooter

iTrader: (12)

Scrappy Jack

iTrader: (2)

Turkish riot police break up protest rallies - Europe - Al Jazeera English

JasonC SBB

Hobbyist drone footage:

http://mashable.com/2013/06/19/drone-journalism-turkey/

George Orwell had it backwards. Today the people have more cameras than the gov't, and soon, more drones!

Godless Commie

iTrader: (2)

Please take the time to look through this:

40 Tragic Pictures From Turkey As Clashes Erupt After Death Of 15-Year-Old Berkin Elvan

newold_m

iTrader: (2)

Oh wow!