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Old 07-18-2012, 11:00 PM   #281
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
need moar wheel spacerz
This is why I shouldn't show pictures until it's completely finished.
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Old 07-19-2012, 09:38 AM   #282
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No way!
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Old 07-22-2012, 04:48 PM   #283
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Looks can be deceiving. Included is the Catfish outline overlaid on a Miata. FYI, stock tire widths were never, ever considered.
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Old 07-26-2012, 12:02 AM   #284
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Default side panels weigh not much

The UPS scale was handy, so we propped a side panel up on it. These are by far the largest pieces on the car, and literally run the entire length. 35lbs? 40? 50?!

21lbs.
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Old 07-26-2012, 12:23 PM   #285
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Was this panel made in what will be your typical material? Fiberglass? Or is this the polymer master for the mold?

Also, I'm really glad to see this coming so far so quickly. So many people have grand ideas that never get beyond the hype.
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Old 07-26-2012, 01:34 PM   #286
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Was this panel made in what will be your typical material? Fiberglass? Or is this the polymer master for the mold?

Also, I'm really glad to see this coming so far so quickly. So many people have grand ideas that never get beyond the hype.
This body is an S-glass layup with carbon fiber reinforcements at the edges. There's no chopper gun or matte used, just woven material.

The next step is to fabricate the mounting points. The bodywork panels that touch will mount to each other. There will also be a front clip, rear clip, four mounting points above the shock towers, and at the rockers.

The bodywork needs to be stiff for our assault on the standing start mile 200mph club.
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Old 07-26-2012, 01:44 PM   #287
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remember when the exocet was the ugliest thing ever made, ever.
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Old 07-26-2012, 01:53 PM   #288
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remember when the exocet was the ugliest thing ever made, ever.


Great concept, though.
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Old 07-26-2012, 01:58 PM   #289
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remember when the exocet was the ugliest thing ever made, ever.
Disagree. While it certainly isn't pretty by any stretch, it's a far cry from some of the crap out there. Remember the Pacer?
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Old 07-26-2012, 11:30 PM   #290
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Disagree. While it certainly isn't pretty by any stretch, it's a far cry from some of the crap out there. Remember the Pacer?
The Pacer? Why not the Aztek? To stay on component cars, it could be argued that the Lotus 7 derivatives ain't that purty. However, it's an iconic design that still can run circles around cars that are FAR more expensive, even 50 years later.

Looks are subjective. First priorities are to engineering and safety. If beauty comes along with the package, all the better. Lucky for us, much of the great engineering comes along with purchasing the donor car.
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Old 07-27-2012, 01:16 AM   #291
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you mention safety. with out going into great detail can you tell me what you have done to make safety a priority? no disrespect, I'm just curious how one goes about addressing safety in a open road race car with a design such as yours.

for instance, the seat brackets retain a miata stock driving position, but it would seem to me getting the seats as low as possible would increase safety from flying pieces off other cars or whatever. the owner could always choose to add a spacer to raise the seat to a stock position.
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Old 07-27-2012, 03:24 AM   #292
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you mention safety. with out going into great detail can you tell me what you have done to make safety a priority? no disrespect, I'm just curious how one goes about addressing safety in a open road race car with a design such as yours.

for instance, the seat brackets retain a miata stock driving position, but it would seem to me getting the seats as low as possible would increase safety from flying pieces off other cars or whatever. the owner could always choose to add a spacer to raise the seat to a stock position.
Building a car like this for something other than personal use--in California--invites every kind of ambulance chaser known to man. Hell, I can just see law suits here because the Catfish isn't "handicap accessible". More importantly, I don't want my name associated with a shoddy, dangerous piece of crap car. That's your short answer.

The long answer is this:

--Ron (our frame builder) is a veteran race car builder whose designs have won the Paris Dakar race, and was tasked with over-building the chassis to be safe. The side rails are high and bend outward after the shock towers. This is good for severe head-on and rear and crashes, as the bars generally bow away from the occupants.
--The car will have all air bags removed, which is safer for a track environment. Who wants to get bumped braking for a corner at 80mph and have your steering wheel airbag deploy?
--The cockpit include harness mounts for a 4, 5 or 6 point safety harnesses.
--There will be a menu of rollbar options, from street hoop to two-passenger roll cage. The customer gets to choose their level of safety.
--The driver and passenger footwells will be double thick. This is to prevent any debris from coming through the floor. Not good.
--There will be engine and rear firewalls to segregate the cockpit from the engine and standard gas tank.
--There are no doors, only cross-braced steel tubing.
--Front clips at front and rear act as mini-crush zones, and parts that can be easily replaced if damaged.

I used to ride sport bikes on the street, but I had too many close calls. Then I moved to the track, but even in a controlled environment you don't have to do anything wrong to be killed on a motorcycle, like the time my RC51 spouted oil on my back tire on the Cal Speedway banking at 140mph. No, I want to have fun on the track and on the road, and not feel like I'm unprotected.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:45 AM   #293
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just catching up... i see lots of pretty rapid prototypes and lots of weird secret talk about them. do not understand.

Proto Labs - Fastest Provider of CNC Machined and Injection Molded Parts
Rapid Prototyping, Custom Manufacturing, Production Parts
Rapid Prototyping and Injection Molding Services | Quickparts.com
Copesetic Inc. Prototype services for product developers. Prototype Solutions, Urethane Casting, CNC Prototyping,
Rapid Sheet Metal - The Fastest Prototype SheetMetal Source

Any of these shops can make them in FDM, SLS, SLA, cast urethane, flexible urethane, machined whatever, and have it for you in a week (except the urethane--maybe 2-3 weeks) and they are no secret. Proto labs does super fast machining in days and injection molds in weeks. Rapid sheet metal can get you parts in a week.

Parts aren't always cheap depending on material volume used but if you've got any experience you understand that fast time to market and early prototypes are worth way more than the cost of a few rapid prototypes in the long run.

and now this post is buried in a 15 page thread. winnerrrr.
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Old 07-28-2012, 12:23 AM   #294
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Yates comes out and says it simpler than I do. Props for that one.

But nevertheless nice progress cord.
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Old 07-28-2012, 02:34 AM   #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y8s View Post
just catching up... i see lots of pretty rapid prototypes and lots of weird secret talk about them. do not understand.

Proto Labs - Fastest Provider of CNC Machined and Injection Molded Parts
Rapid Prototyping, Custom Manufacturing, Production Parts
Rapid Prototyping and Injection Molding Services | Quickparts.com
Copesetic Inc. Prototype services for product developers. Prototype Solutions, Urethane Casting, CNC Prototyping,
Rapid Sheet Metal - The Fastest Prototype SheetMetal Source

Any of these shops can make them in FDM, SLS, SLA, cast urethane, flexible urethane, machined whatever, and have it for you in a week (except the urethane--maybe 2-3 weeks) and they are no secret. Proto labs does super fast machining in days and injection molds in weeks. Rapid sheet metal can get you parts in a week.

Parts aren't always cheap depending on material volume used but if you've got any experience you understand that fast time to market and early prototypes are worth way more than the cost of a few rapid prototypes in the long run.

and now this post is buried in a 15 page thread. winnerrrr.
Rapid prototyping is rapid--IF they don't have any rush jobs in front of them. Usually these companies have larger, established companies that they're burning out parts for. A little guy like me waits at the back of the line. Oh, did I mention that things slow down if my check book runs out of checks and baby needs a new pair of shoes?

I'm working with people who I want to work with, and sometimes that means having to wait for them. Slows **** down, but I don't have multiple engineers and designers on staff, so my ranting and raving about wasted time usually ends up with the person on the other end of the line hanging up on me.

Honestly, if 10 cars are built and I have a car that I'm proud of, I'll be happy. Now if I build 50 a year, recoup the cost and get some cars in the hands of people who share my idea of a true sports car, I'll be really happy.
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Old 07-28-2012, 11:18 AM   #296
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Originally Posted by cordycord View Post
Rapid prototyping is rapid--IF they don't have any rush jobs in front of them. Usually these companies have larger, established companies that they're burning out parts for. A little guy like me waits at the back of the line. Oh, did I mention that things slow down if my check book runs out of checks and baby needs a new pair of shoes?

I'm working with people who I want to work with, and sometimes that means having to wait for them. Slows **** down, but I don't have multiple engineers and designers on staff, so my ranting and raving about wasted time usually ends up with the person on the other end of the line hanging up on me.

Honestly, if 10 cars are built and I have a car that I'm proud of, I'll be happy. Now if I build 50 a year, recoup the cost and get some cars in the hands of people who share my idea of a true sports car, I'll be really happy.
These shops give you a delivery date in days after order receipt. They don't bump you in line. Though I get if you don't have net 30 credit terms, it's much harder to hold payment back.

I don't work for a large moneybags company. We are 12 people and sell a few hundred total products a year in a good year. Our volumes for prototypes are probably in the $2-3000/year range. We're not making them rich.

And yeah, no money, no parts. That's how it works if you're a business or a person like me who wants to change his timing belt but has a baby on the way (no shoes yet, too young).
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Old 07-28-2012, 04:46 PM   #297
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These shops give you a delivery date in days after order receipt. They don't bump you in line. Though I get if you don't have net 30 credit terms, it's much harder to hold payment back.

I don't work for a large moneybags company. We are 12 people and sell a few hundred total products a year in a good year. Our volumes for prototypes are probably in the $2-3000/year range. We're not making them rich.

And yeah, no money, no parts. That's how it works if you're a business or a person like me who wants to change his timing belt but has a baby on the way (no shoes yet, too young).
Congrats on the baby--they're life-changers.

So you're telling me I could have had your company build my 14' long molds?
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Old 07-29-2012, 10:42 AM   #298
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Congrats on the baby--they're life-changers.

So you're telling me I could have had your company build my 14' long molds?
Dont be like that.

First, they aren't my company. Second, I skimmed the thread and didn't specifically read that you're getting 14 foot molds. And finally, I was providing information for the discussion about rapid prototype houses. For small parts (less than 2' x 2' x 2') these are great shops.

I have built my own 14 (well, 15) foot molds for vacuum bagging parts and did not have the luxury of rapid prototyping. If I had a giant gantry mill to machine foam plugs, that would have been nice.

In any case, sorry for crapping up your thread with information that might be useful to everyone but you.
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Old 07-29-2012, 04:19 PM   #299
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Dont be like that.

First, they aren't my company. Second, I skimmed the thread and didn't specifically read that you're getting 14 foot molds. And finally, I was providing information for the discussion about rapid prototype houses. For small parts (less than 2' x 2' x 2') these are great shops.

I have built my own 14 (well, 15) foot molds for vacuum bagging parts and did not have the luxury of rapid prototyping. If I had a giant gantry mill to machine foam plugs, that would have been nice.

In any case, sorry for crapping up your thread with information that might be useful to everyone but you.

For small parts, I actually use SEMA. They have a member service where they pay $5 per square inch for rapid prototyping. Otherwise, I really like the DIY Makerbot system, which anyone on this thread could potentially put on their desktop and use to start building small prototypes.

My large-scale mold builder does a lot of military work, and doesn't want the publicity, or even cameras inside his shop. I comply.
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Old 07-31-2012, 03:02 AM   #300
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Default headlights

The headlight bucket is coming along. We've got a custom surround planned to enclose the light that should look great. The neat thing is that it will be hand made and hand welded, like a piece of automotive jewelry. Not like mass production. the turn signal lens is there just for placement--it's not the production piece.

The stock tires have about 7" of tread. The car was made for a tire width of at least 10", which will fill out the fenders nicely.
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