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Old 01-04-2015, 12:53 AM   #661
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I love having a trustworthy machinist 10 minutes away
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Old 01-04-2015, 01:16 AM   #662
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Man I absolutely love having a trustworthy machinist drinking my beer in my garage looking at my motor.

G I would extend the courtesy to you if I could. Sorry about your luck. You ... you ... man you really seem to blaze the trail for the rest of us to an unbelievable extent for patience in navigating less-than-optimal vendor waters.

I am hereby giving you a long-distanced beer-infused man-hug.
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Old 01-04-2015, 01:18 AM   #663
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I would take great pleasure in helping. And has a great machine shop 10 min away too...If G wasn't 3 hours away.

But seriously, why not assemble it yourself with the help of cool locals like cordus and others? No one cares more about your car than you do, so I doubt some machine shop monkey would take the time to triple-measure everything like you would.

Find a place to properly bore and hone the block, and maybe even mill it and the head flat just for good measure. Then assemble

btw loving the way the tags are stacking up for this thread
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begi isn't helping, buttsex, doubt, failure is an option, fear, iono mang, longing, procrastination, silent but deadly, uncertainty, yearning
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:17 AM   #664
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I love having a trustworthy machinist 10 minutes away
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Originally Posted by Mobius View Post
Man I absolutely love having a trustworthy machinist drinking my beer in my garage looking at my motor.

G I would extend the courtesy to you if I could. Sorry about your luck. You ... you ... man you really seem to blaze the trail for the rest of us to an unbelievable extent for patience in navigating less-than-optimal vendor waters.

I am hereby giving you a long-distanced beer-infused man-hug.
My luck is unbelievable in this regard. With my luck the first time I start this engine the fancy compressor wheel in my EFR will probably explode and take out my whole ******* motor. Then we can discuss my patience. Speaking of patience, I need to remember to call Swain on Monday.

Thanks guys, I appreciate the positive vibes.

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I would take great pleasure in helping. And has a great machine shop 10 min away too...If G wasn't 3 hours away.

But seriously, why not assemble it yourself with the help of cool locals like cordus and others? No one cares more about your car than you do, so I doubt some machine shop monkey would take the time to triple-measure everything like you would.

Find a place to properly bore and hone the block, and maybe even mill it and the head flat just for good measure. Then assemble
I AM going to assemble it myself. Or at least, that's the plan. Motor assembly isn't rocket surgery (he said before he spins a bearing) and I should be able to handle it. I've purchased a scale from Amazon that goes down to 0.01g and I'm going to take a stab at getting the rods and pistons as close to even as possible on my own.

When I have to push to get a crank balanced ("If its from the factory its probably fine") or getting the journals micropolished ("If you didn't spin a bearing you don't need it") or when they question the manufacturer recommended piston to wall clearance ("Its a forged piston so you are going to want at least 0.004") I start to worry about other things. I'm going to stop by the shop on Monday and talk to whomever is running the machines and see if I can get better answers. This should be a simple bore/hone/deck job.

They aren't touching the head, Emilio is taking care of that

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btw loving the way the tags are stacking up for this thread
I've been impressed with them for a while now. I love it when people tag these things.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:24 AM   #665
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sounds like the place is run by hillbillies and they likely don't even know what either of those things are, much less actually do them regularly.

Your paranoia is justified my friend
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:41 AM   #666
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I feel your pain EO2K. If anything it is worse for me. I have 2-3 machinist in the entire area I have access to, none of which I have any idea as to the quality of their work and or experience with engines(car) in particular.

For your sake, I hope happy boost grins are had when it finally comes together.

You have the patience of a damn saint when it comes to assembling a car. I think I would have scrapped the project a long time ago. Remind me to be thankful my car internals/mechanicals were already done and all the hard work(relatively speaking) was sorted out before I built the external shell to shove it all in.
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Old 01-04-2015, 09:14 AM   #667
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Certain things are indeed "fine from the factory", and I generally choose to keep them that way. Lots of stories out there of incorrect boring jobs for forged pistons, for example. Too big and it's scrap, which doesn't even consider out of round, off center, etc.

Also, do you really want to hand your crank to ANOTHER person for a micropolish if we're telling you it isn't needed and you have really bad luck?
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Old 01-04-2015, 09:54 AM   #668
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I found it difficult to find a good machine shop that knows or cares about 4 banger performance. All the knowlegable shops around here here have the older guys that know their stuff, but only do V8 domestic performance builds. If it's a 4 banger it's just a factory spec refresh. My guys actually had an idea what I was talking about when I asked them to build my 1.8 for turbo use.
Generally if your crank is undamaged they won't be able to polish it as smooth as a crank that has some miles on it. I had the same response from my guys years ago.
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Old 01-04-2015, 04:54 PM   #669
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I don't like some of the things I've heard while discussing my engine with the guys at the machine shop. The old dude who did my other 2 motors over the years has retired and I'm absolutely not impressed with the new kid I've been talking to on the phone.
Is this at Rob's? Or another shop?

--Ian
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Old 01-04-2015, 08:32 PM   #670
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sounds like the place is run by hillbillies and they likely don't even know what either of those things are, much less actually do them regularly.

Your paranoia is justified my friend
That's the thing, I think it might be just the guy answering the phone. I'll take a sniff on Monday. I feel I know what to look for and what questions to ask.
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I feel your pain EO2K. If anything it is worse for me. I have 2-3 machinist in the entire area I have access to, none of which I have any idea as to the quality of their work and or experience with engines(car) in particular.
What do they work on, diesel stuff? Diesel guys always seem super hinky to me.
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For your sake, I hope happy boost grins are had when it finally comes together.
Ohhhhh yes... I had boost with the Rotrex (when it wanted to cooperate) and it was super fun. I expect the EFR to blow my pants off.
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You have the patience of a damn saint when it comes to assembling a car. I think I would have scrapped the project a long time ago. Remind me to be thankful my car internals/mechanicals were already done and all the hard work(relatively speaking) was sorted out before I built the external shell to shove it all in.
I'm sorry, did YOU just call ME patient? If that had been my car, I'd have given up. Srs.
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Certain things are indeed "fine from the factory", and I generally choose to keep them that way. Lots of stories out there of incorrect boring jobs for forged pistons, for example. Too big and it's scrap, which doesn't even consider out of round, off center, etc.
True that. I picked 83.5mm as that would give me a minimum "cleanup cut" on the bore for just that reason. I trust the guy I've used in the past to do this, I just need to get a hold of him directly (more on this in a sec)
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Also, do you really want to hand your crank to ANOTHER person for a micropolish if we're telling you it isn't needed and you have really bad luck?
Touché. Though if I followed that logic, I'd just do an epic part out and disappear. I'd be nice to actually finish this
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I found it difficult to find a good machine shop that knows or cares about 4 banger performance. All the knowlegable shops around here here have the older guys that know their stuff, but only do V8 domestic performance builds. If it's a 4 banger it's just a factory spec refresh. My guys actually had an idea what I was talking about when I asked them to build my 1.8 for turbo use.
Its a good point, this is why I want to talk to the machinists directly.
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Generally if your crank is undamaged they won't be able to polish it as smooth as a crank that has some miles on it. I had the same response from my guys years ago.
Its something I'm aware of, but I'd like to hear it from someone who has actually looked at my hardware rather than just waiving me off on the phone.

I feel like I'm one of those noobs trying to justify a poor decision here

I DO trust the guy who works the machines. As I said, the particular guy I worked with in the past has done at least 2 engines for me, 2 other sets of cylinder heads, plus a full engine for my Dad. I went to school with his kids and we went to church together back in the day. He did TONS of performance builds in the area back in the 90's when people around here still had money to do such things. He independently did an SR20 build for a co-worker that is still kicking with the terrible management and abuse he has subjected it to. The problem is that he isn't answering the phone anymore and I keep getting this guy who sounds like he's in his 20s. How often has the person at the front desk been unable to effectively communicate for the guys actually doing the work?

The only reason I didn't want to use these guys in the first place is they usually have outrageous turn around times due to how busy they are. Its the "off season" out here right now as all the money is in Yuma, so the turnaround is like a week.

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Is this at Rob's? Or another shop?

--Ian
Another shop. Rob's is next on my list depending on how Monday goes. I do appreciate the PMs we traded It's a 1.5hr drive one way drive for me so I could take a half day next week and run the block up there if I don't like what I hear.
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Old 01-04-2015, 11:11 PM   #671
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Another shop. Rob's is next on my list depending on how Monday goes. I do appreciate the PMs we traded It's a 1.5hr drive one way drive for me so I could take a half day next week and run the block up there if I don't like what I hear.
Yeah, even from the Campbell area where I live, Rob's is a bit of a hike. I wound up taking 5 trips up there, I think -- poor planning.

--Ian
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Old 01-05-2015, 12:38 PM   #672
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you can haz my nut


I guess we need to let our wives know now...
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Old 01-05-2015, 12:40 PM   #673
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omg there goes my coffee
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Old 01-07-2015, 10:46 AM   #674
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The scoring on the bearings seems so light what do you think it was from? Some of them dont even look like it occurred frequently maybe just a few times. I struggle in this area of engines so hear me out. Do you think it could have been from oil starvation?
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Old 01-07-2015, 12:54 PM   #675
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I'm no expert either, but if I had to take a guess (and I will) I'd say foreign object damage. Some tiny little piece of something managed to get past the oil filter and wreak some havoc on #3. There was nothing I could see imbedded in the bearing itself and the crank looked perfect so meh. The car had like 88~90k on it when I bought it so who knows what the previous owner(s) did for oil and filters. There was some crud in the bottom of the pan but other than that it was pretty clean inside.

From what I understand it, the polishing/scuffing wear really shouldn't be there unless at some point there was contact. Cold start would be my guess except that I don't live anywhere anyone would consider "cold" and the car has no history of being registered anywhere outside the area. The only thing I can guess is a pressure issue. I had a couple incidences where after blasting down I-5 holding 80mph @ 4,000RPM (because 4.3) for 2~3 hours at a stretch, I'd pull off the highway to take a leak and the engine sounded HORRIBLE as soon as the RPM dropped down to idle. Almost like it was not making oil pressure and the rods and pistons were just bouncing around in there. Its was all stock at the time so no real oil pressure gauge, and certainly no oil temp. I was running Mobil1 5-30 (because m.net told me to) and I would not doubt at all that oil temps were above the 240°F "danger zone." I installed a cheap oil pressure gauge and confirmed that yes, I had a pressure issue when very hot. It was a cheapie gauge but it was showing less than 5psi under those conditions @ idle. I was sure I had trashed the motor or that I had significant problems. Many sad pandas wept.

After that I did some more research and switched to Rotella T6 & Wix filters thanks to MT. Extended track sessions running forced induction, high RPM highway cruising, back road thrashing, daily driving... zero issues. A much nicer oil pressure gauge and oil temp gauge gave the the proof I needed that T6 is a no brainer. Now I use T6 in pretty much everything except my wifes Escape.

TL;DR: Foreign object damage from shitty filters/oil, possible oil pressure issues from running shitty oil.
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Old 01-07-2015, 01:42 PM   #676
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Mobil1 5-30


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(because m.net told me to)
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Old 01-07-2015, 01:45 PM   #677
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Hey, everyone has to start somewhere. Why WOULDN'T you trust a place called Miata.net? I've learned a lot since then.

I admit my mistakes so that others can learn from them
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Old 01-07-2015, 03:03 PM   #678
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BLERG! Just called Swain and the "target" for the manifold being done and ready to ship is the 21st.

That really cramps things as I still haven't finalized what I want to do for coolant/oil lines, and I still need to plan out getting together with Gesso to fabricate the rest of the exhaust.
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Old 01-07-2015, 03:12 PM   #679
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BLERG! Just called Swain and the "target" for the manifold being done and ready to ship is the 21st.

That really cramps things as I still haven't finalized what I want to do for coolant/oil lines, and I still need to plan out getting together with Gesso to fabricate the rest of the exhaust.
That gives you ~ten days to get the car together before the NCRC day on the 31st at MRLS...
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Old 01-07-2015, 03:28 PM   #680
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That gives you ~ten days to get the car together before the NCRC day on the 31st at MRLS...
lulz. I'm not sure that even gives me time to get the motor broken in. Even if I complete that, now we are talking about a 8.6 CR N/A motor. Does not exactly sound like funtimes
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