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Old 03-11-2013, 10:36 AM   #161
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* double post
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Old 03-11-2013, 10:45 AM   #162
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I wouldn't pull the head without doing a compression check. If your compression is good then your oil is coming from other than the rings and you may not need to pull the head. Pull the exhaust mani and see if oil is present pre- or post-turbo. You can narrow it down if only one exhaust port is oily. I'm curious if one or more of your valve stem seals became dislodged or cut when you changed valves. It is possible to replace them with the head on the block if necessary.
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:02 AM   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdexta View Post
I haven't seen any specifics on adding a crank sensor to a pre 96 car. Is there a writeup somewhere, or specific steps to walk a noob through it? I have the crank and cam sensors with harnesses off a 99, but no clue how to use them.
You'd wire them back into through the CAS wiring. Do you even have Ms2?
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Old 03-11-2013, 11:15 AM   #164
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Have you looked in your intake to see if you are drawing oil into it somehow?

The fact that all four cylinders are oily makes me suspicious of oil entering your intake.
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Old 03-11-2013, 12:43 PM   #165
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Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
I wouldn't pull the head without doing a compression check. If your compression is good then your oil is coming from other than the rings and you may not need to pull the head. Pull the exhaust mani and see if oil is present pre- or post-turbo. You can narrow it down if only one exhaust port is oily. I'm curious if one or more of your valve stem seals became dislodged or cut when you changed valves. It is possible to replace them with the head on the block if necessary.
I'm going to do the compression check tonight and I'll post results. The exhaust manifold is off and is wet in each cylinder, and definitely appears to be pre-turbo.

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You'd wire them back into through the CAS wiring. Do you even have Ms2?
Yeah, I bought a MS2 from DIY a few months ago. I was too impatient to wait for a built to order MS3 from you or Reverant, which is pretty awesome since the car has only run like 100 miles since then

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Have you looked in your intake to see if you are drawing oil into it somehow?

The fact that all four cylinders are oily makes me suspicious of oil entering your intake.
Yes, I was wondering if it could be the turbo (since I bought it used), I've checked the charge piping and pulled the top of the intake manifold and they're both clean.

You asked about valve seals earlier, I didn't replace them, but I'm like 99.9% sure they are there. The 4 valves I replaced slid in and would hold theirselves in place, I'm assuming if the seals were gone they wouldn't have any resistance at all. That was the first time I've done anything to a head so I really didn't have a clue what I was doing. The seals are definitely my list of things to check though.
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Old 03-11-2013, 06:16 PM   #166
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Compression test, FWIW the tester has always read low. Could have been more consistent, but I would think the numbers are decent for a 9:1 freshly built motor.



Clean intake manifold:


Clean throttle body:


Dirrrty exhaust side of head:
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pdexta's build: round 3-compression.jpg   pdexta's build: round 3-dsc00580.jpg   pdexta's build: round 3-dsc00581.jpg   pdexta's build: round 3-dsc00584.jpg  
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Old 03-11-2013, 06:39 PM   #167
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Compression being even is good. Did you have the throttle wide open when cranking it over?

Are you running 2-stroke pre-mix or diesel by accident? lol

If it is a fresh rebuild it may indeed smoke some until the rings seat. Please tell me that it didn't idle for a prolonged period of time just after first startup. The engine needs varied RPMs and needs a good strong load put on it to seat the rings within the first few minutes. Chromoly rings are the worst if you have them because they are so hard.

Did you alternate the position of the ring gaps, even on the oil rings?

How long had the head been sitting? Are you sure it was in good shape?

Are you absolutely positive it is oil and not glycol?
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Old 03-11-2013, 06:43 PM   #168
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I'd say a leakdown is much more important to do in this case than a comp test
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Old 03-11-2013, 10:58 PM   #169
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Quote:
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Compression being even is good. Did you have the throttle wide open when cranking it over?
I had the top half of the intake manifold off so it was definitely getting air

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If it is a fresh rebuild it may indeed smoke some until the rings seat. Please tell me that it didn't idle for a prolonged period of time just after first startup. The engine needs varied RPMs and needs a good strong load put on it to seat the rings within the first few minutes. Chromoly rings are the worst if you have them because they are so hard.
I expected a little smoke, but it's smoking a lot. It idled just long enough to verify timing and check for any leaks. Then followed FM's breaking, a couple gentle 2000-5000rpm pulls and let it engine break back down. Constantly varying load.

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Did you alternate the position of the ring gaps, even on the oil rings?
Yes, I think I screwed up the oil ring. I gapped it like I did the others, I've heard now that you're not supposed to gap it, just let it compress? Also I read it should butt up against itself and I trimmed it opposite of itself (one piece up and one down, if that makes sense). I really have to read a lot more on this, I guess I was just stupid and rushed it.

I've got someone that's supposed to know what they're doing this time to supervise me and hopefully prevent more faeflora moments.

Quote:
How long had the head been sitting? Are you sure it was in good shape?
A little over 2 years, I bought it from a friend. It had been hot-tanked and properly stored. It looked to be in great shape, but I honestly have no idea what I'd be looking for beyond it being dirty or obviously broken.

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Are you absolutely positive it is oil and not glycol?
Not sure if serious or screwing with me, but it was straight 30w oil, which is what I read was recommended to break in the motor.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:44 PM   #170
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It seems that the issues have been identified and corrected. The car has been reassembled, is running fine so far (although I've only put like 5 miles on it), and not smoking at all.

Before going into my mistakes, I just want to state that: Clearly I'm no mechanic, this is a hobby for me and one that I would never claim to be particularly good at. I enjoy doing as much work myself as I can, even if that means making stupid mistakes.

There were 2 major issues with the motor build (that I'm aware of so far):

First, I attempted to gap the oil compression ring. I read so much about ring gap and concerns of them touching that I made the idiotic assumption that these rings should not touch as well. I gapped them like the others, rather than allowing them to compress in the cylinder.

Second, I did not realize there was an "up" and "down" on the rings. I completely missed the markings on them. Remarkably only 2 of the 8 were on upside down.

While I had the motor back apart I had a friend weld my external wastegate back into the exhaust. Yay, I can put a hood on! There's still a ton of stuff to address, but it's back on the road for now.



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Old 03-23-2013, 09:58 PM   #171
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That's great man. Glad you got it sorted. We take a hefty amount of time when doing the rings at the shop and make sure to double check them at least once for this reason alone.

Can't wait for full boost vids.
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Old 03-24-2013, 08:54 PM   #172
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You got it fixed quick. You must be doing something right. Motor looks great.

Glad to see you get to drive it. It feels good doesn't it.
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Old 03-24-2013, 09:28 PM   #173
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wooohoo, glad to see you got that figured out. You work quickly with motor assembly/disassembly.
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Old 03-25-2013, 12:45 PM   #174
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Glad to see you get to drive it. It feels good doesn't it.
So nice. I've been driving my crappy '01 Civic the last few months. It feels great to take a turn and not feel like you're about to flip.

I'm having some issues with the car stuttering when I roll on the throttle. It was doing the same thing on the last motor, so I feel like it's something electical, or in the tune.

If I tap the gas from idle it will drop RPM's; from ~1000rpms down to ~500 or so. I've even had a couple times that it will stall from idle when I tap the gas with the clutch still engaged. That makes me thing it's maybe an IAC issue, but it seems to do something similar rolling on the throttle from cruise as well (stutters/misses before it accelerates). If anyone has suggestions I'd love to hear them.
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Old 03-25-2013, 12:57 PM   #175
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tip in enrichments?
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Old 03-25-2013, 01:05 PM   #176
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when i have an EMS, I tune things like that out...because why wouldn't I?
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Old 03-25-2013, 01:27 PM   #177
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Like Vlad said, you need to enrich fuel in tip in (the time you open the throttle body). The symptoms you described are the classic signs.
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Old 03-25-2013, 02:17 PM   #178
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Thanks guys. I'll mess with the tip in enrichments tonight. I was hoping it was something simple, just never had the problem prior to this car.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:35 PM   #179
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Definitely not enrichments, I messed with them yesterday with no improvement.

I drove around a little and it started puking oil out the valve cover. When installing the head my torque wrench just stopped clicking, by the time I realized it I'm pretty sure the head was considerably over torqued. I'm guessing I crushed the gasket, probably screwed the head too at the rate I'm going. Seems like that would explain the crap idle/roll on throttle. Probably gonna take a break for a little while.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:38 PM   #180
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oh wow, that sucks dude. I hope its not that
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