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Old 03-18-2013, 11:56 PM   #1
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Default 1.6T or 1.8 Swap

Hey guys, fairly new to Miatas, my friends are telling me the first thing I should do is put a 1.8 in it...but I don't want to, what's the point if my engine is still running strong and healthy
My thoughts were to boost it, sure it costs more but it would make significantly more power than a 1.8 lol
Anyways, I'm quite unfamiliar with turbos, I read the stickied FAQs and they do help a lot, but still didn't answer my question that is, should I turbo the 1.6, or do a swap and save up for a turbo for a 1.8? Are the turbo kits for a 1.6 and 1.8 fully interchangeable? I would think the turbo manifold would be different but anything else? Sorry for all these noob questions, used the search bar and couldn't really find the answer I was looking for, any suggestions or help is greatly appreciated, thanks
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Old 03-18-2013, 11:59 PM   #2
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Btw I'm not COMPLETELY retarded, I know that if I chose the boost route, I would need an upgraded clutch, and 1.8 rear end, so please no one waste your breath telling me that hehe
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:06 AM   #3
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read, read, and read some more. turning a non turbo car into a turbo car is actually quite extensive. It really depends on what you want to do with the car and what you currently use the car for. Go read the I wish I would have thread.
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:13 AM   #4
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read, read, and read some more. turning a non turbo car into a turbo car is actually quite extensive. It really depends on what you want to do with the car and what you currently use the car for. Go read the I wish I would have thread.
Will do
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Old 03-19-2013, 10:14 AM   #5
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extensive? The turbo is the easy part... getting stuck with a 1.6L is a shitty reality.

do the 1.8L swap with a good clutch and turbo later. You won't be sorry.
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Old 03-19-2013, 11:44 AM   #6
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What are your ultimate goals for the car?

A simple low boost turbo setup on a 1.6 can make good power and is really quite straight forward to do. the 1.6 already has an oil feed on the exhaust side of the block for the turbo an fm or begi log manifold and downpipe are simple and straight forward to install and with a smaller turbo will give decent boost response and spool decently.

decide what you want first then figure out the way to get there that works best for you.

Jim
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Old 03-19-2013, 11:48 AM   #7
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I am going to absolutely go nuts on the next n00b moron that legitimately makes these two statements:

1) I have done my research
2) which is better to do, 1.6 or 1.8

Seriously. This deserves a ban.
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Old 03-19-2013, 11:50 AM   #8
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Btw, how would you rate your mechanical skills? you mentioned being unfamiliar with turbos but didn't really indicate your skill/knowledge level in general.

Jim

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Old 03-19-2013, 11:55 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimj64 View Post
What are your ultimate goals for the car?

A simple low boost turbo setup on a 1.6 can make good power and is really quite straight forward to do. the 1.6 already has an oil feed on the exhaust side of the block for the turbo an fm or begi log manifold and downpipe are simple and straight forward to install and with a smaller turbo will give decent boost response and spool decently.

decide what you want first then figure out the way to get there that works best for you.

Jim

A simple low boost turbo setup on a 1.8L car can make great power and is really quite straight forward to do. the early 1.8L blocks already have a oil feed on the exhaust side of the block for the turbo, an fm or begi log manifold and downpipe are simple and straight forward to install and with a smaller turbo, give incredible boost response and spool exceptionally well.

decide whether you want to be stuck with good parts on an inferior, pos engine or not, then figure out the way to get there that works best for you.

Brain
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:03 PM   #10
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Brain, valid points , however the op has to factor in the additional cost of doing the 1.8 swap. if a boosted 1.6 will give him what he needs why bother wither extra cost and work?

Personally I would keep the 1.6 and a gt2554, but I know from 35 years of experience that at this point in my life I would be very happy with that. obviously for a lot of you the 1.8 swap is the right answer, but it's not the right answer for everyone. 15-20 years ago I would probably be saying do the swap, but my goals were a lot different 20 years ago.

btw, what makes the 1.6 a "pos"? They came with turbos from the factory and their are lots of high mileage untouched 1.6s around. and yes I am aware of the short nose crank issues but I don't necessarily consider that a fatal flaw.
Jim

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Old 03-19-2013, 12:07 PM   #11
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the 1.6L sucks in every way, even with a tiny turbo, it cant spool nearly as well or provide a quarter of the torque a 1.8L can provide.

it might take longer for initial boosting, but in the long-run it will be the better decision. Just having a 1.8L block opens up so many more possibities for upgrades and improvements down the road...different heads, IMs, VVT, etc.
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:13 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
the 1.6L sucks in every way, even with a tiny turbo, it cant spool nearly as well or provide a quarter of the torque a 1.8L can provide.
rofl
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:18 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
the 1.6L sucks in every way, even with a tiny turbo, it cant spool nearly as well or provide a quarter of the torque a 1.8L can provide.

it might take longer for initial boosting, but in the long-run it will be the better decision. Just having a 1.8L block opens up so many more possibities for upgrades and improvements down the road...different heads, IMs, VVT, etc.
A quarter of the torque? Are you sure you're not exaggerating just a little....

again valid points, but again all those options cost money and just because the 1.8 provides more upgrade options doesn't mean it's the only solution.

its not difficult to get a reliable 180-200hp out of a 1.6 and if the op would be happy with that why go to the trouble and expense to have options he may never use? of course the op may want those options and may want to swap to a 1.8, but he needs to decide what his goals are before making that decision.

Jim
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:22 PM   #14
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200hp on a 1.6L is nice. 200hp on a 1.8L is better.



this is Shuiend's SR20 T25 on BEGi parts at 10psi with his 1.8L vs. Curly's 1.6L with the same turbo, running 12psi and similar components. the 1.8L will make 50 more rwtq through the majority of the low-end power band. This will feel absolutely night and day amaze-***** on the street in comparison.
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1.6T or 1.8 Swap-t251_6vst251_8.jpg  
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:34 PM   #15
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But bro, WHAT ABOUT THE COST?
I mean we drive supercars with exotic unobtanium engines that cost $100,000 to swap in. This isn't exactly cheap.

lol but seriously: the level of stinginess/cheapness of some folks on here absolutely amazes me. and I consider myself stingy
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:39 PM   #16
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Brain, I totally agree that the 1.8 is capable of more than the 1.6, I never disagreed with you.

Unlike you I am saying their is excellent potential in the 1.6, as long as it's limits are respected and the buillder will be satisfied with it's capabability, the 1.6 is a valid option to consider, there is a considerable extra expense in doing a 1.8 swap, just the engine alone is $500-$1000 (at least around here they are), it's not difficult but it costs money. If the OP doesn't need the the extra power the 1.8 offers and isn't going to buy a vvt head or use a vtcs or squaretop manifold why bother with the time effort and cost?

Jim

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Old 03-19-2013, 12:42 PM   #17
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It's not my opinion; it's fact.

turboing a 1.6L will make you limp
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:45 PM   #18
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lol he is your cryptonite
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:48 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
But bro, WHAT ABOUT THE COST?
I mean we drive supercars with exotic unobtanium engines that cost $100,000 to swap in. This isn't exactly cheap.

lol but seriously: the level of stinginess/cheapness of some folks on here absolutely amazes me. and I consider myself stingy
It's not necessarily about being cheap, I'm 48 years old and I know what I want out of my car. My Miata is a relatively mild 1.8, I could have spent more money and gotten a lot more power, I know I will be happy with roughly 250whp and took the money that I would have spent on more power and did brake and suspension work, believe me my Miata hasn't been cheap, but I wanted a quick, reliable, fun street car, not a track car, so my priorities were obviously different from someone building a track car. It's not always about spending more or spending less but about spending on what you want. If what you want is a built 1.8 with a big turbo, go for it. If what you want is a nice quick street Miata that'll be fun to drive why spend money on things you don't need?

I would love to pick up a pre obdII Miata (either a 1.6 or a 1.8 doesn't matter) and either put a JRSC M45 ( I know sacrilege..) or a small turbo on it and use it as a autoX car, it would be cheap, fun and reliable, not super fast but fun and reliable.

Jim
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Old 03-19-2013, 12:50 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
It's not my opinion; it's fact.

turboing a 1.6L will make you limp
No Brain it is your opinion, the fact is that some people enjoy their 1.6's. So it's not for you, that's cool, run a 1.8 that's your prerogative, but don't pretend like it's the only option, it's not.

NitroDann's 1.6 puts out pretty impressive top end and mid range if I recal correctly...

Jim
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