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250-300WHP Build

 
Old 03-14-2019, 12:17 PM
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Default 250-300WHP Build

So TX2K19 is right around the corner, we had a pre-meet last night, and I saw a fellow Miata owner with a near 300whp stock motor setup. After seeing that, I said f*ck the 600whp build, this is plenty, and I can still drive it on the street. Will cost me way less too and all I'm really after anyway is cool turbo noises and tire smoke.

So! This is my build list now. I am rebuilding the engine first, as I've mentioned it needs a rebuild pretty bad. Compression is currently 125/135/115/145 which is god awful. You may ask why not just get the rods and pistons and stuff right now but I want to be at this power level to get my feet wet before I start spending uber amounts of money chasing 600whp.

Parts:
Mahle Upper Gasket Set (HS54654)
Mahle Lower Conversion Set (CS5878)
Mahle A-Series 0.25mm Undersize Main and Rod Bearings
Mahle Standard Size Rings
Gates Water Pump
Supermiata Coolant Reroute
TDR Oil Pressure Sender
Reman BP6D Head
eBay 10.8lb Chromoly Flywheel (I have a stock Exedy clutch to put in for now but I will change the clutch when I get set up on the turbo)

Plan for the motor is to clean up the block, hone cylinders and install all the new stuff. Will be reusing stock pistons and rods. I'm going to put on a reman BP6D head. I have a 6-speed trans and 3.9 Type 2 Torsen. I already have a nice Mishi rad and fans, I'm sure the coolant reroute will help a lot with keeping it running cool.

At this power level will I need things like a billet oil pump or Fluidampr? Valve springs or head studs? I plan on running 12-15 PSI of boost, and good old Texas 93 unless I add a flex fuel sensor. Before someone says something about the compression of stock pistons, the gas down here is extremely good, I ran 25 PSI of boost on my Mazdaspeed 3 on 93 octane, zero knocking. I'm sure sure 12-15 PSI with 10:1cr is not going to be an issue with the 93 we have.

This is what I have in mind for the turbo setup:

CXRacing GT2871 Turbo Kit
Deatschwerks 550cc EV-14 Injectors
Deatschwerks DW200 In Tank Pump
Spec Miata AFPR
NGK BK7RE-11 Spark Plugs
DIYAutoTune EBCS (I already have an MS3-Pro)
eBay Oil Catch Can
AEM UEGO Wideband

Anything else I'm missing? Will I need to figure out a coolant solution for the turbo or does CXRacing's turbo included with the kit not use coolant? Also an age old question but will the EBCS be worth it? I can always just run wastegate pressure at 12 PSI but I hear an EBCS closes the wastegate for faster spool times. But as I'm not going much above wastegate pressure I'm wondering if it will really be doing anything at all.

As for drivetrain I'm going to put new seals, axles, etc. and freshen everything up (I only mention this part because it's something I still need to do, I've replaced countless things on this car already since the previous owner did not really care for it). Shifter rebuild and poly suspension bushings along with some stiffer motor mounts, probably Mazdaspeed mounts but if I can get my hands on some Innovative mounts then I'll go for those.

Interested to hear ideas and comments. This is a budget build of course, with all the parts listed I'm looking at roughly $4-5K compared to $15K+ for the 600whp setup. I understand the turbo is not a brand name but I've had pretty good luck with Hong Kong hairdryers as have a lot of other people I've seen. Hell the 300whp one I saw last night had an eBay T04.

Goal for this is 250-300whp, daily driver. I don't plan on launching the car 24/7 and beating the **** out of it so I don't mind saving some money here and there. I'd appreciate some CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, if you're here to say this is a cheap *** build then you're missing the point.
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:32 PM
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Only took you about a year to finally realize...
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:47 PM
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Dude seriously stop. You need to do a ton of reading on here still before you do anything.

https://mkturbo.com/9097NA8.html
  1. Buy the mkturbo complete kit and have him keep the ecu to save you some money.
  2. Buy the supermiata radiator and reroute
  3. Engine parts
    1. FM engine rebuild kit
    2. ARP head studs
    3. Manley or Eagle rods
    4. OEM pistons
    5. Damper of your choice
    6. Machine work if needed
Thats a start for a block rebuild and good affordable turbo kit that is proven.
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:50 PM
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Maybe you should let your engine shop decide whether you need undersize bearings or not. Also, "reman" heads are usually nightmares. I wouldn't trust that anything on it has been rebuilt correctly, or the valves shimmed right.

I wouldn't buy a flywheel off of ebay. This is something you're trusting to turn at 7000+ RPM without exploding and cutting off your feet. Mine is the SFI rated unit from FM.

The janky spec miata AFPR? Which is basically a stock unit with a hole drilled in the body and a set screw threaded in? For !!!$150$!!!? Go buy a fuellabs 545 for $175 and be done with it.

Just build the ****** shortblock for ****'s sake. 9.0:1 is what most NA8's are and you're not going to need to spend another $1000 on machine work to do it all over again later.
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by TheScaryOne View Post
Maybe you should let your engine shop decide whether you need undersize bearings or not. Also, "reman" heads are usually nightmares. I wouldn't trust that anything on it has been rebuilt correctly, or the valves shimmed right.

I wouldn't buy a flywheel off of ebay. This is something you're trusting to turn at 7000+ RPM without exploding and cutting off your feet. Mine is the SFI rated unit from FM.

The janky spec miata AFPR? Which is basically a stock unit with a hole drilled in the body and a set screw threaded in? For !!!$150$!!!? Go buy a fuellabs 545 for $175 and be done with it.

Just build the ****** shortblock for ****'s sake. 9.0:1 is what most NA8's are and you're not going to need to spend another $1000 on machine work to do it all over again later.
Strongly agree with this. If you are opening up the motor just build it right the first time with good components that way you dont have to later.
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:01 PM
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It's awesome that after allllll this reading and posting you've done, you've come up with that parts list.

Top marks.
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:02 PM
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Two or three threads ago, we all told you that OEM gaskets were the only ones that were worth a damn. Now, you're telling us you're going to buy a bunch of Mahle gaskets.

It appears you do not listen to the advice you're given.

Why should we spend any time giving you advice here?
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Originally Posted by codrus View Post
Basically I've come over to the camp of "If something is a reliability problem on the track, just ask Andrew and do what he says".
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by achulz View Post
Amazing lack of research
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:10 PM
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Jacobmx5_ View Post
Only took you about a year to finally realize...
Can't argue with that.. took me a while.

Originally Posted by matrussell122 View Post
Dude seriously stop. You need to do a ton of reading on here still before you do anything.

https://mkturbo.com/9097NA8.html
  1. Buy the mkturbo complete kit and have him keep the ecu to save you some money.
  2. Buy the supermiata radiator and reroute
  3. Engine parts
    1. FM engine rebuild kit
    2. ARP head studs
    3. Manley or Eagle rods
    4. OEM pistons
    5. Damper of your choice
    6. Machine work if needed
Thats a start for a block rebuild and good affordable turbo kit that is proven.
I can throw in Manley rods, that's actually not a large addition to overall cost, same goes for ACL bearings. The reason I went with Mahle is because quite frankly I think the FM rebuild kit is a little overpriced. $720 for the NB2 kit and it doesn't even come with rings? I understand OEM gaskets are best but Mahle is pretty reputable as far as I know, I've used their parts for other engine rebuilds and I have no complaints. That and I already have quite a few components on hand, so buying the FM rebuild kit would leave me spending a lot more money for things I don't need 2 of. I already bought their front timing component kit for instance.

Originally Posted by TheScaryOne View Post
Maybe you should let your engine shop decide whether you need undersize bearings or not. Also, "reman" heads are usually nightmares. I wouldn't trust that anything on it has been rebuilt correctly, or the valves shimmed right.

I wouldn't buy a flywheel off of ebay. This is something you're trusting to turn at 7000+ RPM without exploding and cutting off your feet. Mine is the SFI rated unit from FM.

The janky spec miata AFPR? Which is basically a stock unit with a hole drilled in the body and a set screw threaded in? For !!!$150$!!!? Go buy a fuellabs 545 for $175 and be done with it.

Just build the ****** shortblock for ****'s sake. 9.0:1 is what most NA8's are and you're not going to need to spend another $1000 on machine work to do it all over again later.
Does the MK Turbo kit include anything besides the injectors? They do a pretty poor description of what's all included with each package. Also I used an eBay flywheel AND clutch on last NB1. It was a pretty good clutch just had some chatter which is normal anyway. I don't plan to increase the redline anyways and I'm going to use a more well regarded ACT clutch.
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:21 PM
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Sounds great have fun. Stop asking us for input please.
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:23 PM
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If you dont want to listen to our advice why even ask for it. We keep telling you what you plan to do is wrong and you insist that because you did it before it must be good.
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by achulz View Post
I understand OEM gaskets are best but Mahle is pretty reputable as far as I know
So not very far, then
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Originally Posted by codrus View Post
Basically I've come over to the camp of "If something is a reliability problem on the track, just ask Andrew and do what he says".
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Old 03-14-2019, 02:12 PM
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lol at this entire thread. What a f - ing waste of time suggesting anything beyond this point in time.
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Old 03-14-2019, 02:27 PM
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I love this place.
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Old 03-14-2019, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by achulz View Post
... I think the FM rebuild kit is a little overpriced. $720 for the NB2 kit and it doesn't even come with rings? I understand OEM gaskets are best but Mahle is pretty reputable as far as I know, I've used their parts for other engine rebuilds and I have no complaints. That and I already have quite a few components on hand, so buying the FM rebuild kit would leave me spending a lot more money for things I don't need 2 of. I already bought their front timing component kit for instance.
Well, who said you needed to buy a kit? Buying the gaskets individually usually gets you the best price. You just gotta know what you need and don't need.
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Old 03-14-2019, 02:42 PM
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Cxracing turbo kit? As in manifold, turbo, downpipe? Seriously???

Do you see a single person on this site running a cxracing turbo kit?
No? I wonder why that is....?

I know, I know, you know some ricer kids, who told you all their ricer friends run it. So it must be good.

But seriously, you know nothing, and you dont listed to good advise. Stop posting and go to a skidders forum.
They will all praise your turbo build choices.
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Old 03-14-2019, 03:20 PM
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How is this? I am trying to do what I can with a set budget for the rebuild. That's my reason for cheaping out on parts, but I know for a fact every one of you have more experience than me with these cars, so I should listen and take the advice. This is what I can get currently. I will not buy the MK Turbo kit until I have everything on the second list first.

With budget:

FM Rebuild Kit for 01-05 non MSM (ACL bearings)
Manley Rods
Stock Pistons
Wiseco NPR XX Rings
Gates 42134 Water Pump
ARP Head Studs

Other parts I need before I add turbo:

Fluidampr (Can I use the stock timing wheel on this?)
Supermiata Reroute
TDR Oil Pressure Sender

Everything on the second list I can add without taking apart the engine, so I can get those later. I work at a mechanic shop, so I don't have any issue with having to add that stuff with the engine in the car. I will have the machine shop hone the cylinders and do the crankshaft clearances, as well as check over my cylinder head and rebuild whatever is necessary. I won't have the zero wait time like the reman head but if they're junk I'll pay the same price for proper machine work. Scroggins in downtown Houston does great machine work.

Just a couple other questions, I genuinely apologize for being such a ****** noob..

I can continue to use the OEM pump at this power level as long as I have the Fluidampr, correct? And my Mishi radiator with will work with QMAX reroute, or do I have to use the Supermiata radiator?

Again I'm sorry for the arrogance, I can't get anywhere if I don't take any advice. Please let me know if I'm missing anything from the rebuild or if there is something I should add while I have the engine apart.
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Old 03-14-2019, 03:24 PM
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Might as well swap stock pistons for supertech and use arp rod and main bolts too.
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Old 03-14-2019, 03:31 PM
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Now we're getting somewhere.

Stock pistons are fine up to 300whp with good fuel and careful tuning. ARP mains are a requirement at 250whp+ IMO. OEM oil pump is fine at 300whp, but reusing old oil pumps is like reusing condoms. New Mazda oil pump is less than $150 from Comp.

Why are you replacing the oil pressure sender?

Robb M. Why does the WYSIWYG editor delete everything I type after a less-than sign?
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Originally Posted by codrus View Post
Basically I've come over to the camp of "If something is a reliability problem on the track, just ask Andrew and do what he says".
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