If EFR budget... - Page 3 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

DIY Turbo Discussion greddy on a 1.8? homebrew kit?
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

If EFR budget...

Old 07-09-2014, 02:29 PM
  #41  
VladiTuned
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 35,078
Total Cats: 3,113
Default

Originally Posted by Savington View Post
Does anyone actually know of a 6-speed being broken in a street car?
*raises hand*

local kid sheared his 6th gear clean off the shaft

had crappy all season tires too

Last edited by 18psi; 07-09-2014 at 03:22 PM.
18psi is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 02:51 PM
  #42  
Junior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Windsor, Ontario
Posts: 403
Total Cats: 64
Default

Originally Posted by Savington View Post
Does anyone actually know of a 6-speed being broken in a street car?
Bryan/FAB9
BoostedSmurf is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:07 PM
  #43  
Senior Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Meridian, Mississippi
Posts: 628
Total Cats: 42
Default

Looking at the gear ratio's, the RX7 transmission matted up to a 4.3 rear end wouldn't be a bad option at all. Now if you had a Miata that came with the 6 speed 3.909 rear end it would be pretty steep gearing!

If you are making 500 HP I don't see the RX7 transmission gearing with 4.3 rear end being an issue.

Keith
Twodoor is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:10 PM
  #44  
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Leafy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: NH
Posts: 9,310
Total Cats: 80
Default

Originally Posted by Twodoor View Post
Looking at the gear ratio's, the RX7 transmission matted up to a 4.3 rear end wouldn't be a bad option at all. Now if you had a Miata that came with the 6 speed 3.909 rear end it would be pretty steep gearing!

If you are making 500 HP I don't see the RX7 transmission gearing with 4.3 rear end being an issue.

Keith
I would have pointed to the 3.9 or the 3.6 for the RX7 tranny. The FD tranny with a 4.3 is like having the 1st 3 gears from a 6 speed with a 4.10, then the 4th from a 5 speed, and a highway gear.
Leafy is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:12 PM
  #45  
Elite Member
iTrader: (10)
 
soviet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: VA
Posts: 3,494
Total Cats: 261
Default

FAB9

If you give me a new 6 speed I'm sure I'll be able to break mine in short order.
soviet is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:35 PM
  #46  
Senior Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Meridian, Mississippi
Posts: 628
Total Cats: 42
Default

Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
I would have pointed to the 3.9 or the 3.6 for the RX7 tranny. The FD tranny with a 4.3 is like having the 1st 3 gears from a 6 speed with a 4.10, then the 4th from a 5 speed, and a highway gear.
The RX7 transmission with a 4.3 is like having the 1,2,3 of a 6 speed with a 3.636, not with a 4.1. 4th is a 1:1 gear, so it is the same no matter what rear end, and 5th will be a highway gear with what ever rear end you pick.

Stock 6 speed with 3.636 rear end at 7000 RPM (best combo for 6 speed)
1st 34.7
2nd 57.6
3rd 79.4
4th 103.9
5th 130.6
6th 155.0 and 80 mph = 3600 RPM

RX7 TII with 4.3 at 7000 RPM
1st 34.8
2nd 60.1
3rd 87.0
4th 121.1
5th 168.4 and 80 mph = 3300 RPM

RX7 TII with 4.1 at 7000 RPM
1st 36.5
2nd 63.0
3rd 91.3
4th 127.0
5th 176.6 80 mph = 3200

If you put the 3.636 gears in there with the RX7 transmission you are going way tall. If car was making enough power you would top out at 200 mph!
Twodoor is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:38 PM
  #47  
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (10)
 
Reverant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 5,542
Total Cats: 222
Default

Originally Posted by Savington View Post
lol @ "TII gearing is fine"
Not every Miata out there is a race car you know.
__________________
Originally Posted by ninerwfo View Post
The “into to megasquirt thread” mentions that the MS3 basic has 5 inputs with built in pull up resistors - and I was just wondering why it would have so many, while the MS3Pro PnP has just 2 (with no pull ups?)
MS Labs: Plug and Play Megasquirt ECUs for ANY 90-05 Miata (NA, NB1, NB2 w/VVT, MSM), including basemaps to get you started ASAP. PM me or email or details.
For support on MS Labs ECUs: Please email, be sure to include the unit's serial number and include a datalog and your current map.
Reverant is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:41 PM
  #48  
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Leafy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: NH
Posts: 9,310
Total Cats: 80
Default

topping out at 200 sounds perfect for a 500+ hp miata.
Leafy is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:44 PM
  #49  
VladiTuned
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 35,078
Total Cats: 3,113
Default

Oh absolutely. Our cars are so stable and planted past 100.
18psi is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 03:47 PM
  #50  
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (31)
 
Savington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Posts: 15,004
Total Cats: 1,815
Default

Originally Posted by Reverant View Post
Not every Miata out there is a race car you know.
But almost all of the cars breaking 6-speeds are
__________________
Trackspeed Engineering
High-Performance Turbo Specialists - Sunnyvale, CA - 650-701-7223 - Email us!
Originally Posted by codrus View Post
Basically I've come over to the camp of "If something is a reliability problem on the track, just ask Andrew and do what he says".
Savington is offline  
Old 07-09-2014, 05:23 PM
  #51  
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
concealer404's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,800
Total Cats: 1,368
Default

Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
topping out at 200 sounds perfect for a 500+ hp miata.


Attached Thumbnails If EFR budget...-bff5d074d399bdfec6071e9168398406.jpg  
concealer404 is online now  
Old 07-10-2014, 04:06 AM
  #52  
Junior Member
 
muoto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 383
Total Cats: 60
Default

I don't get it. Whats wrong with the RX7 T2 gear rations?

Attached Thumbnails If EFR budget...-t2ratiomph.gif  

Last edited by muoto; 07-10-2014 at 07:39 AM.
muoto is offline  
Old 07-10-2014, 08:49 AM
  #53  
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 3,297
Total Cats: 235
Default

On the street? Nothing. But when every tenth of a second matters on track, the drop from 2nd->3rd->4th is too wide. Compare the TII 2nd-3rd-4th-5th to the 6-peed's 3rd-4th-5th-6th, the 6-speed has much closer ratios.

If you can find a circuit racing gear set for it like this Our Website

But at that point it's probably cheaper to get one of the custom gear sets that will fit into a Miata transmission (5 or 6 speed) so I don't know how promising that is as an option.
thenuge26 is offline  
Old 07-10-2014, 08:57 AM
  #54  
Junior Member
 
muoto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 383
Total Cats: 60
Default

but does the drop matter if I'm still on 400ftlbs torque curve? In my mind wide rations with good torque = less shifting = quicker
muoto is offline  
Old 07-10-2014, 09:21 AM
  #55  
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 3,297
Total Cats: 235
Default

Torque doesn't make you go fast, horsepower does. And even if you make 400ft-lbs from 4000rpm to redline, it's still gonna be faster at higher RPMs.
thenuge26 is offline  
Old 07-10-2014, 09:28 AM
  #56  
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Leafy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: NH
Posts: 9,310
Total Cats: 80
Default

Originally Posted by thenuge26 View Post
Torque doesn't make you go fast, horsepower does. And even if you make 400ft-lbs from 4000rpm to redline, it's still gonna be faster at higher RPMs.
Thrust math beggs to differ. If you have 400ftlbs, perfectly flat from 4000rpms to redline you're going to accelerate at the same rate from 4000rpms to redline. If you change gearing to keep you at higher rpms, then you're going to have better mechanical advantage on the ground and more thrust because of the gear ratios not the fact that you're at higher rpms.
Leafy is offline  
Old 07-10-2014, 09:32 AM
  #57  
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Newcastle, Australia
Posts: 2,812
Total Cats: 51
Default

Can we not use EBC to make a flatter HP curve?

is the point that I am missing that if you can get a bunch of low mid you should already have it?

Dann

EDIT: Leafy just because you explained it in a long winded way doesnt make you righter, thats what he was saying regardless, I think.
nitrodann is offline  
Old 07-10-2014, 09:34 AM
  #58  
Junior Member
 
muoto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Finland
Posts: 383
Total Cats: 60
Default

Originally Posted by thenuge26 View Post
Torque doesn't make you go fast, horsepower does. And even if you make 400ft-lbs from 4000rpm to redline, it's still gonna be faster at higher RPMs.
Then what about with 4.875 R&P? I do have those also

Attached Thumbnails If EFR budget...-t2487.gif  
muoto is offline  
Old 07-10-2014, 11:14 AM
  #59  
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
concealer404's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 9,800
Total Cats: 1,368
Default

4.8 seems excessive. If i were to do it with a BP, i'd go with a 4.3 or a 4.1 with the knowledge that you should be making enough power to shred 6spds on the regular.

MFactory® Competition Products - Gear Calculator





But this.... this is my jam right here.

Attached Thumbnails If EFR budget...-blue%252520miata%252520trans%252520and%252520fd.jpg  
concealer404 is online now  
Old 07-14-2014, 07:14 PM
  #60  
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,644
Total Cats: 36
Default

TQ and good gearing wins races. The thing is, that is almost the same thing as saying HP wins races.

The V10 F1 cars made fairly pathetic TQ next to say a Viper. But since they revved to like 17K, they could use gearing that would have a Viper topping out at 40 MPH. IIRC the rumor was that they would run 9s pretty easily, with only 300WTQ AFAIK

tl;dr The key is to have good TQ multiplication at all times. Having relatively wide gearing splits is not automatically a bad thing if you have the TQ band to match, and you get good multiplication from an aggressive rear gear. That TQ band has to be flat and extend to high RPMs. You can then stay in TQ, run decent TQ multiplications (aka not having to get into lower multiplication/high gears early on), and not have to shift so often either.
Sparetire is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
FAB
Prefabbed Turbo Kits
216
03-22-2017 05:00 PM
stefanst
DIY Turbo Discussion
44
09-28-2015 08:16 PM
samnavy
Insert BS here
1
11-22-2012 03:35 PM
braytonia
MEGAsquirt
2
01-18-2012 12:08 PM
derber
DIY Turbo Discussion
51
06-30-2011 07:36 AM


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: If EFR budget...


Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

© 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.