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Old 08-13-2012, 03:23 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y8s View Post
1. I bet Phil Tobin would be amenable to creating a histogram function for MLV or TS. Data is all there, it's just a different way to display it.
The MLV Beta version displays histograms. It's pretty awesome.

MegaLogViewer Download
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Old 08-13-2012, 03:25 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by Techsalvager View Post
Just learned the word wrong?

There are features of MS that are poorly implemented, implemented wrong or touted as a feature when they shouldn't be.

AEM ems 4 with small harness
AEM SERIES 2 EMS-4 UNIVERSAL PROGRAMMABLE ENGINE MANAGEMENT SYSTEM 30-6905 | eBay

759$ total for AEM EMS4 with small harness

MS3x
MegaSquirt-III EMS System with MS3X Expansion V3.57 - Assembled, Brushed Case DIYAutoTune.com
640$
required harnesses

8' MegaSquirt Electronic Fuel Injection Wiring Harness (MS1 / MS2 / MS3 Ready DIYAutoTune.com
8' MegaSquirt Wiring Harness for MS3X DIYAutoTune.com

779$ total for ms3x assembled with both required harnesses
*noted I used both the small 8" harnessed for the ms3/x

I guess the price difference between the two has shrunk now.

The EMS4 can HARDLY be considered to be on the same level as MS3X. Get real. The EMS4 is an entry level bare bones standalone.

The MS3X is entry level in cost ONLY.

Put it this way, i was actually looking into the EMS4 because i was impressed with the price, and AEM generally has a good reputation/lots of tuners around here.

My tuner specifically steered me AWAY from it because it wasn't going to deal with my motor as well as he liked. (Lack of full sequential injection is just one of the many things he had to say)
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Old 08-13-2012, 03:29 PM   #83
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Well the EMS4 has 4 injector drivers so it had better be able to do full sequential on a 4 cylinder or someone needs to get smacked at AEM.
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Old 08-16-2012, 12:42 PM   #84
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EMS4 does full sequential. concealer's tuner is a liar.
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Old 08-16-2012, 12:53 PM   #85
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I said "my motor."


I can't think of many standalones period that CAN'T handle full sequential on a 4 cylinder, entry level or not.
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Old 08-16-2012, 01:00 PM   #86
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What is your motor?
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Old 08-16-2012, 01:07 PM   #87
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What is your motor?
Well in the example given, it's a KLZE. Kindof. Sortof.

My MSM has a Hydra.

I thought i outlined why i was going Haltech earlier in this thread, might have been another thread though.
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Old 08-16-2012, 01:26 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
My MSM has a Hydra.

I thought i outlined why i was going Haltech earlier in this thread, might have been another thread though.
I'm very interested in listening why you are going to switch to a Haltech.
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Old 08-16-2012, 01:43 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
The EMS4 can HARDLY be considered to be on the same level as MS3X. Get real. The EMS4 is an entry level bare bones standalone.
Care to expound on this? I disagree strongly so I'd like to hear why you think the MS3X is that much better.
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Old 08-16-2012, 01:43 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverant View Post
I'm very interested in listening why you are going to switch to a Haltech.
I'm not, yet. Haven't made that decision.

The car that has the "KLZE" is going Haltech. (Not switching from anything besides the BP05 ECU that was originally in it) The MSM remains Hydra for now. Thinking about doing a "test run" of MS3X on the MX6 next summer, and the winner between MS and Haltech goes on the Celica. (Although, there's a PNP Hydra available for engine in Celica, amusingly...)

Confused yet?
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Old 08-16-2012, 01:46 PM   #91
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I'd like to hear you back this up with some actual fact. I've played with both and I vastly prefer the AEM.
You're misunderstanding what i'm saying.

EMS4 is AEM's entry level offering.

MS3X is the top dog MS offering.

They're similar prices, and overall, it's hard to argue that MS3X isn't more powerful.

I didn't say that one was better for a certain situation or easier to use than the other. I can't speak to those things as i haven't had hands on experience with either.

My post was absolutely not mean to bash or put down EMS4. Looking back, i can see how it might have looked that way, and i apologize for the confusion.
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Old 08-17-2012, 12:27 AM   #92
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They're similar prices, and overall, it's hard to argue that MS3X isn't more powerful.
I sincerely doubt I'm misunderstanding, since you just repeated the same thing again.

I'd like you to provide specific examples of why the MS3X is more powerful than the EMS-4 for a 4-cylinder forced induction application (i.e. the relevant application for this thread and this forum in general).

I'm not crass enough to refuse to tune Megasquirts like some idiots across the country, but I do think that it lacks a couple of major features that the AEM supports. I've played with both and I think the EMS-4 is the superior ECU for our application.
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Old 08-17-2012, 05:22 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
I'm not crass enough to refuse to tune Megasquirts like some idiots across the country, but I do think that it lacks a couple of major features that the AEM supports. I've played with both and I think the EMS-4 is the superior ECU for our application.
What does it lack that the EMS-4 does?

It's likely these missing features could be added - the beauty of MegaSquirt!
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Old 08-17-2012, 06:22 AM   #94
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It's buried in his build thread, but last I heard it was individual cylinder trim, multiple egt inputs (at least four for his application), and something to do with spark. I forget what complaint he had about spark.
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Old 08-17-2012, 07:11 AM   #95
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It's buried in his build thread, but last I heard it was individual cylinder trim,
Does it, and has done since MSII sequential

Quote:
multiple egt inputs (at least four for his application),
MS3X has multiple I/O's available which can be used for this if you want.
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Old 08-17-2012, 07:16 AM   #96
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Well then I could be wrong. I know either the ms3 or ms3x wasn't out/proven when he made the switch.
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Old 08-17-2012, 11:26 AM   #97
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providing evidence:






Just to play devil's advocate a bit here, the MS does have fairly random and sporadic feature updates. If you had looked at its specs 18 months ago, you'd have thought it was mediocre and missing a lot of features.

today it's a different beast.

the firmware is always being updated. some future updates will include the use of an angle clock for scheduling engine events. but that might be a year away.

I'm not sure how many features the "other guys" add after the fact for the average released product. Sav, care to address?
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Cost Effectiveness of different ECUs-ms3x_egtinput.png   Cost Effectiveness of different ECUs-ms3x_injtrim.png  
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:32 PM   #98
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Does MS3X have native high-grade knock control yet? That's always been my primary gripe. AEM offers the occasional update, but most of their stuff is done when the ECU is released (case in point - AEMs have had native VVT control since ~2002). The AEM also has one of the most customization-friendly cam/crank setup screens I've ever seen - annoying for the end user but pure power for the guy setting up the basemaps.

I don't want to rag on it too hard because I used to use one (granted it was an archaic MS1) and I liked it just fine, but I do think the AEM is just a little bit better.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:42 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
Does MS3X have native high-grade knock control yet? That's always been my primary gripe.
Yes. Or so the MS3 forums say - it's one of the reasons I've been wanting to upgrade to Ms3 for awhile.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:49 PM   #100
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Theres a difference between closed loop knock, and OEM like closed loop knock. Up until the series 2 aem there was nothing affordable that had actual good closed loop knock. I didnt think the MS did, though it was coming out with a daughter board soon.
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