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Old 11-16-2010, 06:15 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by y8s View Post
here's the proper way to set up an adjustable body shock for maximum BUMP travel for posterity:


1. jack up car and put on jackstands (rear at least)
2. pull the sway bar from at least one side
3. remove a shock and remove its spring. reassemble it normally just without the spring
4. shorten the shock body to the minimum but dont lock the collar.
5. install the wheel on that side
6. jack up the suspension arm on that side slowly and see what contacts first: tire or bumpstop or something else
7. lower the suspension arm and lengthen/shorten the shock until the arm jacks up with the shock hitting the bumpstop and the tire clearing everything by 1" (you should be able to reach your hand around and feel)
8. lock the collar for the shock length adjustment down.
9. reinstall the spring and the full coilover and then repeat on the other side of the car (or measure the shock body length and transfer it.

10. then once the shocks are all installed and happy, jack the suspension arm again and roughly set your ride height by turning THE SPRING PRELOAD COLLAR.

11. match the other side
12. lower and verify height. repeat til satisfied. don't touch the shock body length.

now you can ride super low without rubbing yourself the wrong way.
Humor me. Please. longer springs of the same rate may just frustrate you more.
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Old 11-17-2010, 03:44 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by hustler View Post
You might consider ordering real springs like Hyperco or Swift:
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-..._3777240_n.jpg
My 700/400lb springs are both a smaller in wire diameter than your spring, and have one less coil and a smaller diameter spring. The Swift springs are really light too.
Actually, that's the plan, now. Read below.

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Originally Posted by y8s View Post
Humor me. Please. longer springs of the same rate may just frustrate you more.
I reassembled everything the way you described except for running the spring loose. I actually preloaded the spring intially (I know, I know ). Ride quality felt a little better at first, but at the first sign of large road bumps/potholes the thud was back. This time it was coil bind. I backed off the preload and it's back to the way it was before. Rides great on perfect roads but bottoms out at the first sign of rough patches. I need to shoot a video of the shitty, construction area that I have to go through everyday to get to and from work to show you guys why I'm bitching about my suspension.

I spoke with one of the suspension techs at Stance again, yesterday. He said, judging from my pictures, that all wear looked normal, and the assembly and settings looked fine. He confirmed that spring length is not an issue unless I'm coil binding. He suggested that I should maybe consider stiffer rear springs if hitting the bumpstops was bothering me that much. He said the dampers are valved to "accept" (his verbage, not mine) springs with in 2k higher or lower. I'm on 8k/6k currently, so that means I could use anything from 4k-8k (224 lbs-448lbs) in the rear. I haven't decided if I just want to get better rear springs (i.e. Swift) with the same rates or increase the stiffness all around with something like a 10k/7k (560lbs/392 lbs) setup.
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Old 11-17-2010, 03:55 PM   #63
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maybe you just need longer softer bumpstops...
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Old 11-17-2010, 05:12 PM   #64
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I'd probably ask him specifically if there is enough rebound damping to run a specific rate, which they aren't.
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Old 11-17-2010, 06:55 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by hustler View Post
I'd probably ask him specifically if there is enough rebound damping to run a specific rate, which they aren't.
I was told the dampers could handle springs with in +/- 2k. Are you saying that I should ask the tech more specific questions? Or are you saying that even though he said the dampers could handle the increased spring rates, the dampers won't be able to handle them? Sorry man, but your wording is confusing me, and I already don't really know what I'm doing here .
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Old 11-17-2010, 09:40 PM   #66
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XCLR8TN posted some shock dynos of the AL+ before on m.net:
FRONT: http://s69.photobucket.com/albums/i5...tDyno-1024.jpg
REAR: http://s69.photobucket.com/albums/i5...rDyno-1024.jpg

If you compare this to XIDA Club's rear shock dyno,
http://949racing.com/images/Xida_S_Rear.jpg

It looks like STANCE's stiffest setting is close to mid-setting of the XIDA clubs.

EDIT: Just realized 949 put XIDA-S's dyno under the Clubs.

Anyway, I don't see why it wouldn't be able to handle the 6k / 336lbs/in spring rates on the Stance coil-overs. Just tossing this out there. Of course there is more to a shock than what is shown on a shock dyno...
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Old 11-18-2010, 01:28 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
maybe you just need longer softer bumpstops...
Cheapest option might be to try the 54mm bumpstops from Ground Control.
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:21 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by greeenteeee View Post
EDIT: Just realized 949 put XIDA-S's dyno under the Clubs.
Xida CS & S are the exact same damper. Different mounts.

CR.net post on a set of Stance dampers I had dyno'd a few years ago.
http://clubroadster.net/vb_forum/sho...2&postcount=75
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Old 11-18-2010, 09:30 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by wannafbody View Post
Cheapest option might be to try the 54mm bumpstops from Ground Control.

At $12, that wouldn't be the cheapest option...


this on the other hand:

http://www.hondapartsnow.com/genuine/honda~rubber~51722-SR0-003.html



Its ~65mm out of the bag and costs $4.99 each.
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Old 11-18-2010, 09:47 AM   #70
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Nice ribbing on that dumper bumper...any larger diameter?
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Old 11-18-2010, 02:19 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
Xida CS & S are the exact same damper. Different mounts.

CR.net post on a set of Stance dampers I had dyno'd a few years ago.
http://clubroadster.net/vb_forum/sho...2&postcount=75
Wow, that's very interesting info. Your analysis from that shock dyno pretty much sums up the problems I'm having. Great ride and response on smooth roads, and very rough over any uneven surfaces and bumps. The fronts aren't really too bad, but the rears are very harsh over large bumps, slamming into the bumpstops. Thanks for spoon feeding me and leading me to that post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wannafbody View Post
Cheapest option might be to try the 54mm bumpstops from Ground Control.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
At $12, that wouldn't be the cheapest option...

this on the other hand:

http://www.hondapartsnow.com/genuine/honda~rubber~51722-SR0-003.html

http://lh5.ggpht.com/Tofuman86/SL43k...2/IMG_2831.JPG

Its ~65mm out of the bag and costs $4.99 each.
Going off Emilio's post, I've only got 76 mm of rear travel, so 65 mm bumpstops might be a bit much unless I trim them down. For $5 each, I'd say it's worth trying them out.

I'm probably going to get larger bumpstops, better springs (haven't decided if I want to go a little stiffer or not), and put the dampening in the rear to the max; I'm at 12/15 right now. Anybody have any hot tips on where to find Swift springs cheaper than $85 per corner? Thanks for all the help.
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Old 11-18-2010, 02:20 PM   #72
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yeah, you could trim them down and make 55mm bumps out of them
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Old 11-18-2010, 02:30 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by chricto View Post
Going off Emilio's post, I've only got 76 mm of rear travel, so 65 mm bumpstops might be a bit much unless I trim them down. For $5 each, I'd say it's worth trying them out.
I say this is a good bet, and it's easier to remove a little at a time on bump stops (use a wire to saw through them) than to add it.

At the end of the day, this is a street car and your suspension settings don't really matter as long as you're comfy.
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Old 11-18-2010, 02:59 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by hustler View Post
At the end of the day, this is a street car and your suspension settings don't really matter as long as you're comfy.
This ^ is the main point. My Miata is my only car, so I'm just trying to find a compromise between performance and drivability. I've had the car four years now, and I'm finally hoping to compete in my first autox next month. I went to the Spokes event in SA last weekend and felt like a tool showing up in a Miata and not running it.
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Old 11-18-2010, 03:57 PM   #75
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This ^ is the main point. My Miata is my only car, so I'm just trying to find a compromise between performance and drivability. I've had the car four years now, and I'm finally hoping to compete in my first autox next month. I went to the Spokes event in SA last weekend and felt like a tool showing up in a Miata and not running it.
You probably felt like a tool because you are a tool. Next time you're there tell Jeff Warden and Troy Acosta that I said they could eat my **** on toast and they better hope and pray that I never come back down there to crush their hopes and dreams...again.

Isn't Stanford's car crazy?

You should run with those guys, you'll learn a lot considering several national champs are in that crew including Dan Pedroza, Jeff Warden, and his divine lordship Andy Hollis. I predict you dump off this suspension for something better after you get a taste of the auto-x. If you want and they'll let me, I'll take you for a few laps in my car to show you what you're missing at HHR on Saturday.
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:12 PM   #76
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I predict you dump off this suspension for something better after you get a taste of the auto-x. If you want and they'll let me, I'll take you for a few laps in my car to show you what you're missing at HHR on Saturday.
While I agree w/ hustler, the more serious you get about track/autox, you WILL want a better damper.

At the same time, you already have the STANCES on, so why not go out and try it. I am on sub-par coil-overs (many would say crap coil-overs), and I am merely trying to learn all of the intricacies of a quality damper, while trying to confirm what I learn on the track. SoCal has some bumpy tracks, but it is just a good stomping ground to learn the inadequacies of the shocks you have now. Once you step up to something better, you would appreciate it more. My shocks and their dynos look very much like the STANCE dynos and I can agree they perform well on smoother surfaces, but driving a shock over rough roads separates a quality damper from the rest. I wish I can afford the XIDA Club Sports... but $$$.

I'm looking to FLEX or MONO FLEX next... price/budget is still a huge concern as I need a clutch/fly also, what keeps me hesitant on a new set of FLEX is the 7/6 rates. I've grown accustomed to 10/8 w/ hollow front sway and I like the balance right now. A few more track days would allow me to decide if I want a 10/7 next or if I can life w/ a 9/6 (twin tube FLEX w/ 9k non-revalved). I am not sure if non-revalved FLEX can handle 10k up front.
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:18 PM   #77
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While I agree w/ hustler, the more serious you get about track/autox, you WILL want a better damper.

At the same time, you already have the STANCES on, so why not go out and try it. I am on sub-par coil-overs (many would say crap coil-overs), and I am merely trying to learn all of the intricacies of a quality damper, while trying to confirm what I learn on the track. SoCal has some bumpy tracks, but it is just a good stomping ground to learn the inadequacies of the shocks you have now. Once you step up to something better, you would appreciate it more. My shocks and their dynos look very much like the STANCE dynos and I can agree they perform well on smoother surfaces, but driving a shock over rough roads separates a quality damper from the rest. I wish I can afford the XIDA Club Sports... but $$$.

I'm looking to FLEX or MONO FLEX next... price/budget is still a huge concern as I need a clutch/fly also, what keeps me hesitant on a new set of FLEX is the 7/6 rates. I've grown accustomed to 10/8 w/ hollow front sway and I like the balance right now. A few more track days would allow me to decide if I want a 10/7 next or if I can life w/ a 9/6 (twin tube FLEX w/ 9k non-revalved). I am not sure if non-revalved FLEX can handle 10k up front.
Off topic:
If you can afford tein flex or mono, you can afford Xida.

I agree, track what you have. I auto-x my daily driver and the tire-rub adds to the fun. Why didn't you run again? If you think you're going to be competitive in spokes as a newb it would surprise me...those guys are crushers. On a lighter note, I don't know a circle of people more fun that the spokes group.
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:18 PM   #78
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I didn't think teins were even considered anymore.
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:19 PM   #79
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Yeah, there were a lot of quick cars there. I can't remember all the names of the drivers, though. I wish I could head back out there on Saturday, but I'll be at the UT game :(. I'll take you up on the offer another time.

As far as the Stances go, all I saw was the price when I bought them. They are mono tube and they were cheaper than comparable Teins, so I went with them. If I had it all to do over again, I would have just sent the factory Bilsteins off to FatCat. eh, you live and you learn, I guess.
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Old 11-18-2010, 04:27 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by hustler View Post
Off topic:
If you can afford tein flex or mono, you can afford Xida.

I agree, track what you have. I auto-x my daily driver and the tire-rub adds to the fun. Why didn't you run again? If you think you're going to be competitive in spokes as a newb it would surprise me...those guys are crushers. On a lighter note, I don't know a circle of people more fun that the spokes group.
I didn't run because I'm on three nearly bald Azenis and one nearly bald random used Goodyear. I've got brand new Falken Zeix 912s that are going on this weekend, and I'll hopefully have fresh pads on by Dec. 5 for the next event. I need to do my homework on the class specs, too.
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