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There's too many coilover options (11 page thread to explain 80 page thread)

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There's too many coilover options (11 page thread to explain 80 page thread)

Old 08-10-2018, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by shuiend View Post
You do realized that all the adjustable coilovers in the sub $1200 market are all BC with just different color shocks, stickers, and springs.
This should be quoted a million times for it is the truth.

Honestly, Xidas are a bargain because you won't have to rip them out later to replace them with something good.

Buy BC crap now for 1200 isn't a savings of 500 over Xida GS because the Xida GS guy isn't going to be buying new coilovers in a couple of years.
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Old 08-10-2018, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by AlwaysBroken View Post
This should be quoted a million times for it is the truth.

Honestly, Xidas are a bargain because you won't have to rip them out later to replace them with something good.

Buy BC crap now for 1200 isn't a savings of 500 over Xida GS because the Xida GS guy isn't going to be buying new coilovers in a couple of years.
Very true, I put VMAX classics on my car because my stock suspension was dead and I couldn't afford to go XIDA at the time, and supply / cost of billies was may too high (stupid crappy Canadian dollhairs). I'm still eyeing up XIDA's, it's my end game, it should be yours as well if you aren't going the billie route.

TL;DR: I bought cheap coils, I'm going to spend money twice. Don't be me
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Old 08-10-2018, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by 2slow View Post
Goodwin will not fit front, rear only. For front Garagestar, TwoSixMotorsport, ISC. But if you are doing that - may as well get all the same.

Here is my old set as an exaple

Goodwin fits front in NA.

I dont' remember what OP has, because i didn't really care that much.
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Old 08-10-2018, 01:40 PM
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Speaking with nearly 20 years of Miata wisdom here, either go straight for Xidas or leave everything stock. Most of the cheap choices will make the car drive shittier. You won't go faster and you won't have as much fun.

FM still sells that retarded giant rear sway bar with everything and nearly all the mid range garbage (the 800-1200 BC pick a color coils) will have inappropriate damping and spring rates.
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Old 08-10-2018, 02:00 PM
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I like bilsteins just fine. I've driven in MSM with 700 400 xidas and thought it was fine also. For the $1,200 difference I would say that a student driving a street car could do without just fine. He's not chasing tenths of a second in a race class. It's like saying you can't tow a Miata with anything smaller than an F-350 diesel. Not only do I not agree with it, I think it's absurd. Xidas are nice but so are any properly valved shocks for the accompanying spring rates. Bilsteins with 400 300 are really nice. Really nice.

Really nice.

Really nice.
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Old 08-10-2018, 03:58 PM
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I currently run the goodwin top hats in the front of my NA, so yes, they do fit.

I also run 550 / 350 spring rates on my NA street car. Ride is comfy and I just came back from a 3k mile round trip on them. No complaints here or from my GF.

In fairness, I have never ridden on a bilstein setup with 450/300 spring rates. I did ditch my illuminas with FM springs in favor of my bilstein setup and with the bilsteins my car is comfier.
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Old 08-10-2018, 03:59 PM
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Maruha extended top hats are about $74 per pair whereas goodwin top hats are $75 each. So a savings of $150 if you go maruha over goodwin.
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:03 PM
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550/375 on Koni Sports. Crappy/Harsh ride not found. Not sure where people get that opinion. They're better than the last two sets of Billies I've had.

But, carry on.
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:05 PM
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In my case, mostly from driving Braian's car. That thing rode horrifyingly bad. :P
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:23 PM
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The only conceivable reason I can think of to lower a street car is for looks. If you really care about the lowz, I'm not judging. But if you just want a great riding and handling street car, stay near stock height and ditch the coilover idea entirely. Now you can afford something pretty respectable.

I have an NA. I'm running NB top hats with new bushings, NB FM springs (318/233), NB B6 Billies, stock sway bars. The street ride is great, just as comfortable as stock. I also drive the ever-loving **** out of the car at the track on 320 treadwear tires, and it's fine. Maybe a little roly-poly compared to a dedicated track setup, but I almost never get on the bumpstops and I'm generally within 10% of Spec Miata lap times. My point is that I don't know why you would want a harder/more agressive setup than I have it you don't plan to drive faster/better than me at the track.

TL;DR: Low. Good. Cheap. Pick whichever two you like.
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:41 PM
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yay, more solid "i've ******* done this, it works" info

I too have a NA, but I think I have NB tophats (bought some used stock suspension to get through inspection and he included some extras) but like others are saying I'd just buy all 4 from somewhere this way they're all the same. I'll be able to salvage the washer things and just order new oem bushings online.

So 550/350 is good? I could go somewhere in the middle like 500/375 but I think im just splitting hairs. 450/300 seems more along the lines of what I want. Someone said student wanting a fun street car, precisely my situation (maybe someone read the post history?). Just want a solid upgrade over stock (which I found out is 164/96 holy soft). a 550/350 setup would be about 3.5 times as stiff overall. a 450/300 setup would be about 3 times as stiff. either choice will net me in a much better place than I am right now.

~more noob time~
How does preload work? Say I'm running a 550/350 setup, how do you make the ride not **** but still be low(ish)? If the spring is 550lb/in, how many lbs do I add? or should i just immediately take the car to get cornerbalanced at a local shop? reminder that I would like to be in FM Vmaxx range of 12-12.5" front and 12.5-13" rear cause that just seems like a comfortable fun/functional height that is generally accepted as good for streetability (I have a big GV rep lip that may scrape itself to pieces).

I love learning this kinda **** because you wont see someone with the same setup as you (at least I won't locally), and I'm kinda leaning towards this now because the more I look, the more I see that there isn't really a "perfect" setup for what I want (ASIDE from spending the extra $ on xidas). There's either too stiff, not balanced correctly front to rear, or missing small things like the extended top hats. So since I just spent money on wheels, I'll probably have to wait a little then start picking things up slowly. School will also detract time from money making but hey, i'm not gonna put them on in the winter anyway.
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:44 PM
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550/350 is plush. Much of the comfort in a Miata suspension is having enough spring rate to avoid getting into the bumpstops constantly.

But, your butt may require different things than mine.

The lower you are, the higher the spring rate you need. The height you're looking for, i would personally not be looking at rates any lower than 550/350. YMMV. The good news is that if you try springs you don't like, turn around and sell them to recoup most of the spring money, and try different rates. The world is your oyster.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post

Much of the comfort in a Miata suspension is having enough spring rate to avoid getting into the bumpstops constantly.

The lower you are, the higher the spring rate you need.
Quoted for truth. Worth pointing out that this is pretty much the whole design rationale for the Xida GS. Stay close to stock height = retain normal suspension geometry, get away with softer springs, get plush ride AND good handling.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
550/350 is plush. Much of the comfort in a Miata suspension is having enough spring rate to avoid getting into the bumpstops constantly.

But, your butt may require different things than mine.

The lower you are, the higher the spring rate you need. The height you're looking for, i would personally not be looking at rates any lower than 550/350. YMMV. The good news is that if you try springs you don't like, turn around and sell them to recoup most of the spring money, and try different rates. The world is your oyster.
So then the final breakdown would be:

NB Bilstein B8's
550/350 Hyperco 7" springs
Allstar Performance 5" coilover sleeves
QA1 thrust bearing kit
Maruha extended top hats
OEM bushings for the top hats (https://www.flyinmiata.com/nb-shock-bushing-set.html)
Energy suspension isolators (same as OP in Better Bilstein Coilover thread)
Bump stops, the OP used some pricey *** ones ($18 EACH) are there some cheaper ones that'll work? cheap *** says $18 for one bump stop im gonna hack up is too pricey.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:15 PM
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You could use the hacked up materials from the bump stops as the replacements for the oem bushings in the top hats. No need for the thrust bearing kits. I had that on my setup before I went to the goodwin front and rear top hats.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Schroedinger View Post
Quoted for truth. Worth pointing out that this is pretty much the whole design rationale for the Xida GS. Stay close to stock height = retain normal suspension geometry, get away with softer springs, get plush ride AND good handling.
but im a bit of a butthurt and a little racecar stance won't hurt. i'm not gonna be dragging frame, just low enough to take away the MONSTER TRUCK that the car is right now... ( the dumb heavy wheel one)

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Old 08-10-2018, 05:22 PM
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Maruha will sell the top bushings for next to nothing as well.

Use the $18ea bumpstops. If you want to go ultra poor, search that thread for Honda part numbers, but that feel silly to me.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
Maruha will sell the top bushings for next to nothing as well.

Use the $18ea bumpstops. If you want to go ultra poor, search that thread for Honda part numbers, but that feel silly to me.
found the maruha ones. Top hats are $30 each? so $120 for the set + shipping. and the bushings are listed as upper and lower, so I should get 4 of each ya? derp moment cause I thought they were the same whoops.
E: the marhua ones are only 20mm. Will that be good enough for all around?
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by concealer404 View Post
In my case, mostly from driving Braian's car. That thing rode horrifyingly bad. :P
I was going to request a swap if you'd brought the street car to compare and contrast between my Koni's (revalved for 600/350 springs) and your Bilsteins. I've debated updating my coilover setup using tender springs and different top hats or getting Bilsteins.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:44 PM
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Should have asked for a swap anyways, or driven Cameron's car. He has the same setup as the street car, just with a little higher spring rates.

Performance/ride quality wise i cannot tell a difference between Hater's Xidas and the prior iteration of the Bilsteins.

But hey, scene points and 10lbs lost. To bad it came at the expense of now using the crappiest spring sliders i've ever seen in my life, but c'est la vie.
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