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Old 04-27-2010, 04:36 PM   #21
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YESuCAN. First fix ur diff.
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Old 04-27-2010, 04:40 PM   #22
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i gotta buy one then if i can afford 3.63 R&P then that what will happen
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Old 04-27-2010, 05:09 PM   #23
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Subscribed to this...
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Old 04-27-2010, 07:12 PM   #24
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I'm going to try everything I can in order to NOT shim the subframe on this project. The oil pan is already shorter than Rob's by 3/4" and I'll be doing some completely custom motor mounts to drop it as much as possible.

The goal with this motor/car this year is actually driveablility/trackability.

I didn't get to nearly enough track days last year so I'm holding off the Holset for this year and I'll be running a set of 1000 GSXR itbs coupled to the stock lower intake mani (ported) and a custom long tube header with ridculous primaries. The goal is to make enough power to not get beat by the wifes b16 civic lol

Oh ya and a 4.78 final drive.

The 6 speed is mounted to the motor but I wont be showing how until I get my flywheel here and everything actually fits like it should. Don't need false information floating around teh intrawebs.

The cas is easy compared to the rest of the stuff that needs to be done, pull out the slotted wheel, drill a couple holes, slap it back in, in the proper orientation of course.

Water inlet for the pump needs to be fabbed up as the fe3 one is different.

Like mentioned the oil pan needs some work, need to find a Kia unit if you go with a jdm motor as I did.

Also you'll want the FE3 cams, my motor came with a FEAP/FE3 cam arrangement which is being replaced with another FE3 kia intake cam. And the Kia exhaust cam wont drive the CAS unit so you need a jdm mazda cam if you wanna run the CAS.

Coolant reroute, use an mx6 thermo housing.

Anyways we'll see how "worth it" it really is when I get it all together and dyno it, hopefully the gear ratios will compensate for the extreme lack of power I'm predicting lol.


-Dean
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Old 04-27-2010, 07:44 PM   #25
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Can't wait to the see the 6 spd "mate up"... if it's real.
And IRTBs? Did you see this?

Sounds good to me.
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Old 04-27-2010, 07:54 PM   #26
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^^ Yup saw that one before, but I'll be running the itb's unrestricted lol

Can't wait, 4.7 rear, 9lbs flywheel, itbs, FE3 cams, 6 speed, long tube header, should be fun and loud if nothing else lol
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Old 04-27-2010, 07:58 PM   #27
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I ditched my thoughts of doing an FE3 swap because I didn't want to get stuck with a 5sp so i'm really interested to see how you dealt with this.

Edit: also if you wouldn't mind posting up a price list of what you ended up with in the end.
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Old 04-27-2010, 08:23 PM   #28
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^ Full details on the 6 speed once I can confirm it will work and not explode the trans.

Price is all relative to how well/nice you want the install to look. Cheapest way possible, this swap can be done for engine price plus a couple hundred for odds and ends. Nothing major other than welding some things together is really required.
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Old 04-27-2010, 08:25 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dc2696 View Post
^ Full details on the 6 speed once I can confirm it will work and not explode the trans.

Price is all relative to how well/nice you want the install to look. Cheapest way possible, this swap can be done for engine price plus a couple hundred for odds and ends. Nothing major other than welding some things together is really required.
Ya I realize that. I'm just trying to keep some mental notes of what these engines are going for plus the little stuff that is needed. I'm not scared of the fabrication at all. I'm curious to see how you accomplish this without spacing the subframe and still close the hood.
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Old 04-27-2010, 08:26 PM   #30
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are you using the miata 6 speed?
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Old 04-28-2010, 11:05 AM   #31
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Are you concerned with the low profile oil pan as far as oil starvation?

Also, take some more damn pictures before you get this thing completely in the car! I have a KIA block in my garage, still might go this route.. especially curious to see what power you can make NA (you have programmable ECU?)

Also, any chance you did some weight comparisons?? Like to know how accurate the 50 lb estimates I've heard thrown around are.

Tim

Last edited by timg; 04-28-2010 at 11:32 AM.
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Old 04-28-2010, 11:29 AM   #32
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I'd say my swap was done as cheaply as possible - at the time since. The engine was $900, bell housing $75, 626 flywheel $45, sportage pan $38, and $300 to make the hybrid intake manifold. The rest of the stuff was done using scrap metal/parts.

I drove mine around without the turbo, blowing through the turbine housing and the torque was great. Pretty much choked around 5500rpm though.

All that? Meaning oil sourcing? The sump where the pickup sits is deep. Apply a similar baffle to the BP and all is good. Add an external cooler and it's better.

BP to FEdohc weight comparisons were made based on scale numbers- but two different scales. The difference similarly dressed is more like 65lbs.
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Old 04-28-2010, 11:34 AM   #33
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Editted my message.. "all that" did sound pretty teenage kid didn't it.

65 lbs is tons.. so really only makes sense if one is going to do the neccessary upgrades to run 300 whp+ (otherwise why not save 65 lbs and boost a 1.8 BP?). I guess 65 lbs might be worth it for the cost savings over a similarly reliable BP at 250 whp (forged pistons/rods which aren't needed for FE3).

I guess I'm just bummed about the weight difference.. as far as a track car is concerned.

Tim
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Old 04-28-2010, 11:53 AM   #34
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I am kinda worried about oil capacity but Im still working on the pan so once it's finished I'll know what the capacity will be.

Pics will come with progress, I'm writing finals all week then I have my boilers branch exam Monday so until that's done the car is on hold.
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Old 04-28-2010, 12:52 PM   #35
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Depends on who you are- to me 65lbs is nothing for a street car. Even as a track toy it's not a significant enough of deficit to matter when you consider where the car starts as a platform compared to others. The apply typical mods/adjustments to address the weight change. In nearly all cases the driver is going to leave far more time on the table than what a 65lbs weight increase is going to cost.

Dean if you run an external cooler, there won't be oil capacity issues. My pan held over 4.5 qts - that was with about 1/2" of oil sitting in the shallow part and those stupid kickouts I added (which probably only added .25 quart). My tiny external cooler and lines added another .75qt.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:06 PM   #36
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Fair enough on the weight gain, still a consideration.

Dean, can you confirm that the KIA FE3's have the 'good' cams (both on intake and exhaust)? I've been having some difficulties tracking down that information.

Tim
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:10 PM   #37
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Rob, I completely agree that 65lbs is going to be insignificant on either a track or street car.

My 1.8 rearend added weight, as does my butterfly brace, half cage ect ect

The benefit of the engine is straight up reliablility.

Thanks for the heads up Rob, my pan is shorter than yours but Ill be making it slightly longer and alittle wider so it should be fine.

Did you have to move your swaybar or not? I know you did but could you have gotten by without moving it?
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:13 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timg View Post
Fair enough on the weight gain, still a consideration.

Dean, can you confirm that the KIA FE3's have the 'good' cams (both on intake and exhaust)? I've been having some difficulties tracking down that information.

Tim
Kia has the good FE3 intake and a shitty KL03 or somethig exhaust, definately not as good as the FE3 cam. IMO it's worth it to source the jdm Mazda FE3, 700$ online is **** all for a motor. Then you have the good exhaust cam, slightly higher compression, ability to run the CAS and the intake is easily cut for itbs.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:16 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dc2696 View Post
IMO it's worth it to source the jdm Mazda FE3, 700$ online is **** all for a motor. Then you have the good exhaust cam, slightly higher compression, ability to run the CAS and the intake is easily cut for itbs.
Good points really, and then once you have the Mazda FE3 head and such, you could pick up the Kia motors cheap when it's time for a fresh bottom end.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:21 PM   #40
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Couple shots of my buddies working on the itbs. Skill saw put to good use lol, I'll get a picture of them now all sandblasted and ready for porting.

And this is what your trying to deal with by shortening the oil pan ect.
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The hood line is alittle higher than the bare fender line, and that pic is the oem Kia oilpan sitting on the subframe, nothing modified.
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