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Old 11-09-2012, 09:12 AM   #141
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Irrational paranoia
STFU, Toby.
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:35 AM   #142
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Lol @ Toby.
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:36 AM   #143
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Maybe I shouldn't have said "current administration" and "killing us" as a blanket statement cause a few of you took that to heart. All I know is, it seems like A LOT of obstacles to juggle though just to keep the doors open and trucks on the road as the years go on.

Who knows, maybe I'M being misinformed.
Vash - [Full disclosure, I voted for Romney/Ryan] It is possible that there are legitimate issues and obstacles presented by the current administration as it relates to certain businesses, but if you can't name any specifically, there probably aren't any for you and your business.

That's not to say local politicians haven't done something to make business more difficult or that the current administration couldn't have done a better job assisting with the broader economy. A stronger broad economy would likely mean more demand for most everyone's product.

But, the Obama administration's "anti-business" attitude has mostly been talk up to this point (unless you are in the coal industry).
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:47 AM   #144
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You guys are right , Romney would have ruined this country. And Im a racist cuz im white and I voted for Romney. I own a very small business so I guess now Im better off that Barack put all those tax breaks through that I will never use. Maybe I need to actually watch Fox news so I can be ignorant with reason as opposed to being ignorant because I see the world around me in real life. I need to see the world as the theoretical "better" world you say I live in. Thanks, I feel much better now about the "fake" world I was living in before. I will now just walk around with my eyes closed as I have been enlightened and dont need my vision anymore.

Without the sarcasm, do you guys honestly think Romney could do that much better/worse than Obama? Not all tax breaks are going to work for everyone and trying to take advantage of all those tax breaks could just as easily bankrupt you if your company cant sustain the added liability. My company cant grow, so I cant use them. I AM NOT blaming the president for my lack of business growth. I actually think things will get better for me but that is also not due to any policy of the president. So 95% of black people voted for Obama and they arent racist? I missed what Fox news had to say about that as I dont watch TV media.

My problem with politics is that everything is a popularity contest and no one is better than the Democrats at it. They speak of wanting to do everything that is popular regardless of what it might mean to the whole of the country. Healthcare? I just spent 5 hours in an emergency room with my wife as she nearly passed out with flu like symptoms. It took someone with authority (a minor care nurse) to finally come over and say "you have the flu and you cant do anything but wait it out, take this for nausea and then start taking tylenol and motrin". FIVE HOURS?!?!?! What in Obamacare is going to relieve this situation. Nothing!!!! The answer is total reform, not free medicine but you think Obama or any other candidate has the power to fix it. Absolutely not.

I dont mind paying taxes. I mind my taxes being used for bigger government and social programs that I cant benefit from. It is my money so I should benefit from it. If all the freeloaders out there want to have social programs benefitting them, let them start paying taxes. I plan to be rich one day and I dont think having to give an even higher percentage of my pay to someone who doesnt have the common sense to use a condom or hold down a job is putting my tax money to good use. Its a lack of respect that has gotten us to where we are. Self respect and respect for others, accountabilty and responsiblity are all things lost on this country right now. Its always someone elses job to fix whats wrong or give me what I didnt earn. Its a freaking high school popularity contest whats going on in this country. And we all remember high school politics and I dont mean the actual student president crap.
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Old 11-09-2012, 09:57 AM   #145
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I posted my reply to the usgp thread here like a noob.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:03 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by hector
So 95% of black people voted for Obama and they arent racist?
First of all, it was under 90%. Which is significant because 84% of black people voted for Clinton. So no, they aren't racist.

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Originally Posted by hector
I just spent 5 hours in an emergency room with my wife as she nearly passed out with flu like symptoms. It took someone with authority (a minor care nurse) to finally come over and say "you have the flu and you cant do anything but wait it out, take this for nausea and then start taking tylenol and motrin". FIVE HOURS?!?!?! What in Obamacare is going to relieve this situation.
Well, when people actually have health insurance, they won't have to go to the ER because they actually have insurance. Therefore the ER will be less crowded. That's how Obamacare is going to relieve the situation. Do you even know anything about Obamacare?

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If all the freeloaders out there want to have social programs benefitting them, let them start paying taxes.
wat.

Are you serious? Just so you know, they aren't paying taxes because they aren't making any money. If they could pay taxes, then they wouldn't need social programs.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:12 AM   #147
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You are serious? Freeloaders dont pay taxes because they dont make any money? Get out town! What a shocking revelation! THAT IS THE PROBLEM!
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:17 AM   #148
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You are right, black folks arent racist for voting for a black (actually mulatto) president but white folks are racist if they vote for a white candidate! Give me a break dude. Everything is about race in this country when it comes to white folks not voting for a black president.

And for the ER thing, there was no need to have my wife go there in the first place. The nurse at the clinic recommended it as she looked so sick. The 5 hour wait is what is not necessary and simply induced by the hospital. Hey, they got $300 from me on the spot.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:25 AM   #149
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You are serious? Freeloaders dont pay taxes because they dont make any money? Get out town! What a shocking revelation! THAT IS THE PROBLEM!
So they should go to the magical money tree and harvest some money?

Oh, no that's right, you want them to die on the streets.

For all the talk of "not all rich people are evil, its a few who make the rest of us look bad" I find it hilarious that the conservatives on here are ready to throw the "freeloaders" under the bus. If you want to go ahead and provide a statistic about how many "freeloaders" there actually are (as opposed to people who really need help) I would love to see it. The highest I have seen is 2% of welfare recipients committing fraud. Everyone knows someone who is on welfare and doesn't want to find a job because of welfare. Give me some ACTUAL numbers. I am willing to be convinced. But I am not willing to stop benefits to 98% to keep 2% from "freeloading" because that is retarded.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:33 AM   #150
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So they should go to the magical money tree and harvest some money?
its funny cause it's true.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:35 AM   #151
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I love it how everything is about numbers. You find absolute truth in numbers dont you. Here is something I cant give you in a number: how many people I have come across that have spouted off, "why should I get a job, it doesnt pay me better than the gov't for doing nothing". Im sorry I cant get you a number on that. Simple truth, people are taking advantage of this situation we are in right now and they see no reason why they should have to do anything to help themselves when they have people like you who are more than willing to help them. Open your eyes. Im not saying to disregard everyone. This country has always been socialist, just with lower taxes and less people draining on the system. We cant afford to keep maintaining everyone who is not going to be responsible for themselves or going to want to help their fellow citizen.

Edit: I just thought about your statistic of 2% committing fraud. Would those be the 2% that admitted to committing fraud or that got caught or the actual number because the all-knowing came up with the data. Go ahead and ask me if Ive ever cheated on a test before. I might give you an honest answer but you wont know if its true. I have never been caught cheating on a test so maybe I havent. You dont know do you?

Last edited by hector; 11-09-2012 at 10:46 AM. Reason: ramblings
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:37 AM   #152
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To be fair you will never get a good statistic on the "freeloaders" just like you can't get and accurate statistic on tax fraud because you don't know who is a "freeloader" unless you catch them and they are kicked off the system. I am not claiming that it is a high percentage but I am saying that I feel the 2% figure is not accurate because it is either only the people they catch or a completely speculative figure.

EDIT: I am also a much bigger advocate of charities and other programs to help those in need as they are much more efficient than any govt. funded programs. As has been stated before republican states are far more charitable then liberal states. This includes the southern states where many of the conservatives are not wealthy and live outside of the metropolitan areas. We don't want to let people die in the streets, but we don't think it is the govt's job to take care of the problem. I would much rather donate my own time and money directly to my community than give it to the govt. so 40 cents of every dollar can actually make it to helping those who need it.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:38 AM   #153
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I love it how everything is about numbers. You find absolute truth in numbers dont you.

Yes. Numbers have no bias.

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To be fair you will never get a good statistic on the "freeloaders" just like you can't get and accurate statistic on tax fraud because you don't know who is a "freeloader" unless you catch them and they are kicked off the system.
Sounds good. I will stop grandstanding about the 1% destroying our country by not paying their fair share when you guys stop grandstanding about the freeloaders that are taking your money! Because I know bbundy won't :P
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:53 AM   #154
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Steve, its not that I dont want to help people help themselves and trust me, I am not above anyone else economically to think that I one day wont need the gov't help. The thing is that I dont think its fair to anyone to be forced to pay for other people and not be able to get anything in return for themselves. Mind you I said "forced" to pay. If you want to be charitable, you shouldnt expect anything in return but taxes are not choices. I think everyone should pay taxes, poor or rich. If the gov't is giving you money you are getting income and you should pay taxes for it. This does not apply to retirees, they have payed enough.

But yes, lets agree to disagree.
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Old 11-09-2012, 10:55 AM   #155
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I love it how everything is about numbers. You find absolute truth in numbers dont you. Here is something I cant give you in a number: how many people I have come across that have spouted off, "why should I get a job, it doesnt pay me better than the gov't for doing nothing". Im sorry I cant get you a number on that. Simple truth, people are taking advantage of this situation we are in right now and they see no reason why they should have to do anything to help themselves when they have people like you who are more than willing to help them. Open your eyes. Im not saying to disregard everyone. This country has always been socialist, just with lower taxes and less people draining on the system. We cant afford to keep maintaining everyone who is not going to be responsible for themselves or going to want to help their fellow citizen.

Edit: I just thought about your statistic of 2% committing fraud. Would those be the 2% that admitted to committing fraud or that got caught or the actual number because the all-knowing came up with the data. Go ahead and ask me if Ive ever cheated on a test before. I might give you an honest answer but you wont know if its true. I have never been caught cheating on a test so maybe I havent. You dont know do you?
Another one that cannot seem to form rational thought doesn’t understand numbers and fails to understand the economics of parasitism. A successful parasite is one that is not recognized by its host, one that can make its host work for it without appearing to be a burden such as the oligarchs in a capitalist society. Mitt Romney’s personal past business experience would make him the poster child for the successful parasites that are destroying the American way of life and the overall economy. His policies seem to want to make it easier for the real parasites to suck out all the proceeds of productivity. It will not help the honest businessmen or working Americans this biasing all the advantage more towards the utility of big money it would likely bring us to the next great depression just as it did in the past if you study the history of just 100 years ago.
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Old 11-09-2012, 11:01 AM   #156
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Steve, its not that I dont want to help people help themselves and trust me, I am not above anyone else economically to think that I one day wont need the gov't help. The thing is that I dont think its fair to anyone to be forced to pay for other people and not be able to get anything in return for themselves. Mind you I said "forced" to pay. If you want to be charitable, you shouldnt expect anything in return but taxes are not choices. I think everyone should pay taxes, poor or rich. If the gov't is giving you money you are getting income and you should pay taxes for it. This does not apply to retirees, they have payed enough.

But yes, lets agree to disagree.
Ironically, social security income for the retired is taxable if it is over a certain amount which is not very much.
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Old 11-09-2012, 11:10 AM   #157
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The thing is that I dont think its fair to anyone to be forced to pay for other people and not be able to get anything in return for themselves.
But you are getting something in return. As a business owner, you can have healthy employees who are clean, well fed, can get to work, etc. They are also purchasing things, helping the economy. You aren't directly benefiting in that the govt isn't writing you a check, but that doesn't mean you don't benefit.


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If you want to be charitable, you shouldnt expect anything in return but taxes are not choices.
I would LOVE it if charities could cover what the government does now. That would be GREAT! One problem. We tried that. For instance, the poverty rate among the elderly was something crazy like 60% before the Social Security Act passed. We started these welfare systems in response to people suffering. If private charities were a real solution, then we wouldn't have even NEEDED welfare in this country.

If someone has some evidence that we wouldn't return to the pre-depression poverty numbers I would be interested to hear it.

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But yes, lets agree to disagree.
That we can agree on.
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Old 11-09-2012, 11:16 AM   #158
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You are right, black folks arent racist for voting for a black (actually mulatto) president but white folks are racist if they vote for a white candidate! Give me a break dude. Everything is about race in this country when it comes to white folks not voting for a black president.

And for the ER thing, there was no need to have my wife go there in the first place. The nurse at the clinic recommended it as she looked so sick. The 5 hour wait is what is not necessary and simply induced by the hospital. Hey, they got $300 from me on the spot.
You're delusional: the african-american coommunity has historical voted democrat since Roosevelt.

FactCheck.org : Blacks and the Democratic Party

It's true that blacks as a percentage of the population utilize welfare at a much higher rate. It's also true that the black community has not progressed much over the past 3 decades (all sorts of rates such as births out of wedlock have gone up). This said, I don't understand how the white middle class cannot accept that it's an issue of education and poverty versus race.

Political preference is far more nuanced then a group simply 'seeking handouts' (unless we're talking pro-life and union voters).
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Old 11-09-2012, 11:28 AM   #159
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You dont understand the race thing I am referring to. White folks are being accused of being racist if they vote for a white person. This is the race issue I am referring to. White people cant vote without them being called racist. Period. You have gone out of your way to prove black folks vote democrat but have said nothing about white folks and their voting habits.

And I never mentioned anything about social programs benefiting only blacks. You brought that up on your own. I have seen too many people of any color take advantage of the "economy".

Bob, if the parasites you claim are so hidden, how come you know them so well? How come every poor person accuses them of their own problems?

Retirees dont get taxed for income unless its more than what they are allowed to make but then they arent retired now are they? And social security isnt exactly all social. You pay in and your employer pays in and supposedly that money grows and yadayada. So maybe an inverse system for people who are down on their luck. We pay you now and you pay us back?
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Old 11-09-2012, 11:31 AM   #160
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I love Obama's foreign policy.....

Iran fighter jets fired at an unarmed US drone on Nov 2nd. This, of course, was not made public until Nov 8th. Obama administration response was to "Issue a stern complaint via diplomatic channels." That is a direct quote. I am not saying to start a war but his lax policies in the middle east are starting to make this country look weak and our enemies are gorwing emboldened.
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