1.6L 2560r record attempt - Page 5 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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DIY Turbo Discussion greddy on a 1.8? homebrew kit?

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Old 02-07-2013, 12:14 PM   #81
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Hot air intake!
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Old 02-07-2013, 12:39 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
Supposedly a 90* bend in any pipe will give you about as much internal drag as 20 feet of the same pipe if it were straight. I'm sure this varies with the radius of the bend. That being said, I would just come straight out of the turbo with the air filter.
In fairness, at least this way the filter is not directly behind the fan which will be actively blowing hot air out, as opposed to the current location which will just have the air being drawn through the radiator?

I would think that empty space behind the AUS passenger headlight might be a better option?
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Old 02-07-2013, 01:03 PM   #83
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hot engine bay is always hot.
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Old 02-07-2013, 01:08 PM   #84
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Fan will only be a contributor when sitting still. Everything will be hot under there all the time anyway. I just object to the possible restriction of flow on the vacuum side of the compressor.

Try to eliminate tight bends first, eliminate open bends second, and eliminate excess pipe length third, was how I believe I heard it years ago.
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Old 02-07-2013, 01:15 PM   #85
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^Pretty much. Bends in the post compressor piping arent too bad, since head losses are based on volume flow the volume flow is pretty low. But before the turbo volume flows can get pretty big.

Nifty Cheat Sheet
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Old 02-07-2013, 01:20 PM   #86
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your mom can get pretty big
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:58 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
Cause it'll have to be redone for the efr turbo anyways.

Without exhaust bigger than 3" or an open exhaust, a giant turbo, crazy built engine, etc, I don't see how this is going to be a record killer. Whats the power goal again?
The current record for ANY miata with an unmodified GT2560 is 310rwhp. This car made 297 rwhp with an AVO log and 2" downpipe and 2.5" exhaust with a 20k old cat etc.
The record holder is a 1.8L with begi manifold and 70mm TB.
This car is a 1.6L with 100% stock inlet side.
If the difference between this and the last setup is 15whp the record is broken.
It wont prove anything but help me learn how to build an efficient setup.
An EFR 6258 will bolt onto this setup (already tried it) with only a days worth of minor fab changes, for now we thought, hell lets leave the little T25 on and see how good the setup really is.

To the move the filter crew

All of the new bits are only tack welded together, I have until sunday to decide on any changes before its permanent hence asking.

Of the 2 filters we had on hand neither would fit in between the turbo and the radiator.
Pod Filters all have a 3" inlet and the turbo has a 2", you can see in the photos that there is a nice cone reducer to do this cleanly and not distrupt flow. With this piece in place the filter cannot fit, the total length is too much.

If i go buy a smaller filter with less filter area is that worse than a long radius 90* bend?

Thanks,
Dann
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:06 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nitrodann View Post
If i go buy a smaller filter with less filter area is that worse than a long radius 90* bend?

Thanks,
Dann
If you google it garrett has a technical document in pdf form that has the procedure for sizing a pod filter.
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:17 PM   #89
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Thankyou leafy, here, let me take one of your neg props away.

What I should do is keep this filter setup, only tacked (the fitup is perfect) and on the dyno do a couple of pulls without it. Open turbo.

Then we will know for sure.

Dann
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:29 PM   #90
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placement wise your setup kind of sucks for getting a filter anywhere. You cant put it behind the headlight because the turbo is too far forward. I wonder, is it possible for you to go through the hole in the upper rad support that we use for over the rad intercooler piping and have room for your filter in front of the radiator?
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:34 PM   #91
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It is, its also possible to remove the left headlight and put a panel filter against the underneath and cut a few big holes, so that from outside the whole headlight cover is basically a panel filter to the outside of the car.

I actually have a jackson racing IC pipe just for the over the rad setup but i really dont know if its worth anything on an intercooled car running past the turbos efficiency band.

Also it will need changing in a couple months with the EFR.

The turbo is in a difficult spot for an intake but I wanted to be able to fit this and the EFR with absolutely no compromise in the down pipe, and have option for 4" downpipe with large radius bends.

Dann
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:47 PM   #92
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4" down pipe?! I though I was going big with planning on 3.5. Monster car mods did a dyno test with a skyline between a bunch of different filter options and on that car the only way they noticed a real change (1.6% aka 3 hp) was when the filter was completely outside of the car.
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:55 PM   #93
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You mean mighty car mods?

If not well they did a test too and made an extra 3hp with a silly setup, but hey 2hp may be the difference for the outright gt2560 record haha.

As for the 4" everything is ready to go, I just go up to 4" with a cone from the turbo outlet, do the 2 bends for the downpipe and then come back down to 3" with another cone and add another V band on the other end (V band on turbo in this case, EFR)

Dann

Last edited by nitrodann; 02-07-2013 at 08:05 PM.
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Old 02-07-2013, 08:12 PM   #94
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Any time I see a DP similar to my old greddy unit I cry a little bit.

Mine:


Vs yours:


When you do the EFR, I vote for as straight a DP as possible. Your manifold seemed to take half an hour to build, I say if you're making a record 1.6, even with the EFR, make as low a mount as possible. Your limiting factor is the oil drain I think.
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Old 02-07-2013, 08:20 PM   #95
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The EFR, touted as the best turbos you can buy uses a single 3" pipe straight out the back, also this cars runs ALL OF IT, the wastegate never opens past 50% throttle, so why it needs to be divided I dont understand.

Unless you are pointing out the nice photography Im not sure I understand your point. It has a lot of welds and bends, but apart from being divided I can't see any difference except I managed mine with a very simple design. I can certaintly make a divided downpipe, I just didnt have divided flanges and didnt realise that this was a poor design for this application..

As for the manifold, what do you mean it took half an hour?

I want genuine feedback, what would you change?

Dann
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Old 02-07-2013, 08:28 PM   #96
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Its the turbine housing getting too close to the u joint on the steering rack is limiting how low mine is mounted. The down pipe is just going to have to wiggle a few times. And Sav clued me in on a tip for the EFRs, treadstone sells a v band flange that they make for the EFRs that let you run either a 3" or a 3.5" down pipe directly off the flange with no cone needed.
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Old 02-07-2013, 08:39 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nitrodann View Post
As for the manifold, what do you mean it took half an hour?

I want genuine feedback, what would you change?

Dann
I mean you built it really fast.

And I would change the outlet bend, I thought mine was a little straighter than yours, but it could be a trick of the eye. I have no opinion or facts about the divorced wastegate tube.

I guess Tim's low mount DP would be a better example



Maybe it's not that big a deal, but that's what I'd change. You're welcome btw, for waiting until manifold fab was done before speaking up.
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Old 02-07-2013, 08:45 PM   #98
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Cheers haha.

Yeah ok you were saying if I can build this one in a couple of days I could build another low mount by tomorrow and test it? Not sure i can be bothered doing that also by next week haha. But again it can always be sold and redone if we arent happy.

Heres a better pic of the downpipe.



Dann
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Old 02-08-2013, 11:35 AM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nitrodann View Post
The current record for ANY miata with an unmodified GT2560 is 310rwhp. This car made 297 rwhp with an AVO log and 2" downpipe and 2.5" exhaust with a 20k old cat etc.
Did your car make 297 rwhp on the same dyno as the "record" holding car that made 310rwhp? As in the exact same dyno, on the same day?

If not, then how can you possibly compare the two?
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Old 02-08-2013, 12:10 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Efini~FC3S View Post
Did your car make 297 rwhp on the same dyno as the "record" holding car that made 310rwhp? As in the exact same dyno, on the same day?

If not, then how can you possibly compare the two?
Was waiting for this. It's like making rulers out of silly putty to measure your gentleman's sausages and pretending like they're accurate measurements. Different dyno = different results = pointless

Anyway, Dann, I see nothing wrong with your downpipe. Yes it has a little more bending going on but that's not really going to make that big of a difference, and the diameter is HUGE. I don't think you need to worry about it.
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