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Old 01-25-2012, 07:25 PM   #41
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I would start with an 01 Miata with VVT and build the motor over the max hp then retune using the VVT to get the most under the curve while just at max whp. I would also run the largest tire I could. Can you get away with running a 245 hoosier r80, open diff, xida, and factory sway bars?
R80s add 30 points, so no. :(
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Old 01-25-2012, 09:20 PM   #42
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The fastest tire for TT (A-F) is going to be an A6. The tire that will be almost as fast, last longer and will be fun to drive is an R6. Also, in some testing that I have done, a nearly stock powered Miata is no faster on a 225/45/15 R6 compared to a 205/50/R6. Now that I have a bit more than OEM power, the 225/45/15 tires are preferred.
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Old 01-26-2012, 12:16 AM   #43
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Also, in some testing that I have done, a nearly stock powered Miata is no faster on a 225/45/15 R6 compared to a 205/50/R6.
Thanks for posting that. I've always heard rumors and speculated that that might be the case, but never heard any real proof from a fast driver that's done legitimate testing. One less set of tires I'll be buying for the initial round of testing on my naturally aspirated TTE 1.6 car.
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Old 04-20-2012, 09:58 AM   #44
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Subing. very interesting thread. I myself am coming from SCCA solo and time trials in CSP , to doing the NASA events at the new NOLA motorsports park. I have been studying the rules and points structure. I sent in my dyno and weight to greg and got PTE**.

The car weights in right at 2000 in AX trim, add me (210), the bar (45), hardtop (45), safety gear (+15?) and more fuel and it should be right over 2300lbs. My SAE corrected best dyno is 147WHP. its a 96 with a VVT motor, standalone, all the bolt ons suspension, etc.

so here is how my points add up
My car as is base class is TTE**
+14 points from the ** for my power to weight of ~150WHP and 2300lbs
+2 for my basic 225/45-15 kook rs3’s setup
-1 for 225mm wide tire (235 TTE base tire)
+3 for Torsen LSD
+7 for suspension (+3 shocks, +2 springs, +2 sway),
+2 for brakes (even though they are smaller 1.6 brakes, they are not 1996 base trim model aka BTM)
+3 for R model lip. (Its not factory BTM so it counts as an air dam.)
Total = 30 points. (10 into TTD)

Options to maximize my points in TTD

Option 1: road race tires with aero
-2 remove kooks +7 for NT-01’s
-3 +3 removed the R model lip and put on a big splitter
+4 Add wing. I am thinking the GTC 200 that 949 sells.
+2 hack up rear bumper cover so not a parachute and/or add elise diffuser
-2 Swap to 1.8 brakes
= 39 points

Option 2: Stickier Road race no aero
-2 remove kooks +10 for Hankook Z214 C71’s or Hoosier R6
-2 Swap to 1.8 brakes
+2 hack up rear bumper cover so not a parachute and/or add elise diffuser
= 38 points.

So what do you guys think. nittos with aero or hossier and no aero?
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Old 04-20-2012, 12:50 PM   #45
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I would bet R6s or C71s would put down faster times than NT01s and aero. But I'm no expert, lol.
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Old 04-20-2012, 01:45 PM   #46
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yeah, I am also thinking thats the way to go.
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Old 04-20-2012, 02:49 PM   #47
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205 hoosier R6 with aero?

205 R6 would be +3 overall (+10 tire, -7 size)

So:

** = 14
Tire = 3
Susp = 7
Diff = 3
Air Dam = 3
Wing = 4
Rear diff = 2

Total = 36 (points to spare, A6s if you can afford them?)

I would bet a 205 A6 with aero would be faster than 225 r6s with no aero.

Do you have enough power to need the 225s?
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Old 04-20-2012, 02:55 PM   #48
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all I have is 15x9's to race on.
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Old 04-20-2012, 03:11 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by trigger View Post
all I have is 15x9's to race on.
205 R6s have a 220mm casewidth. I am going back and forth between 205 R6s and 225 NT-01s on Rover for PTC, but either tire would go on a 9" wheel.
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Old 08-01-2013, 05:44 PM   #50
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Bump from the dead vs. creating a new thread for thoughts on this basic TTD build.

'90 VVT swapped necessary work to get around ~145whp. IIRC from one of hustler's posts, his dyno reclass was TTE* ~145whp/2390 min comp weight (Does this sound about right?)

* +7
205 R6 +3
LSD +3
949 BGK +7
949/TSE front/rear brakes +2
FM butterfly brace +3

Use remaining 7 points to drop 95lbs off comp weight?
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:01 PM   #51
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You can't drop weight using points if you're dyno-classed unless you request a lighter TTE** classing.

Bracing is a really bad place to spend PT points.
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:10 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
You can't drop weight using points if you're dyno-classed unless you request a lighter TTE** classing.

Bracing is a really bad place to spend PT points.
Where would it be better to spend (I am debating the same thing).
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:19 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Savington View Post
You can't drop weight using points if you're dyno-classed unless you request a lighter TTE** classing.

Bracing is a really bad place to spend PT points.
That makes sense. Would using those points for an Eprod bumper and rear wing make more sense?

I know it's not the best, but damn it's so nice to have those jackpoints and extra stability on the floppy '90.
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:56 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by z31maniac View Post
That makes sense. Would using those points for an Eprod bumper and rear wing make more sense?

I know it's not the best, but damn it's so nice to have those jackpoints and extra stability on the floppy '90.
Simple way to look at PT points is to asses a time quotient for each point used.

IOW 3pt for LSD might be worth 1s on a 2:00 road course with one or two slow turns. Those same 3 pts might be used for an airdam that's only worth .5s on the same course. Thus, the LSD is the better choice. Those braces have to be pretty damn magical to equal the lap time decrease of an OS Giken over and open diff. Get the idea?

You have to know your car, and the tracks you will optimize for.
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Old 08-01-2013, 07:16 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
Simple way to look at PT points is to asses a time quotient for each point used.

IOW 3pt for LSD might be worth 1s on a 2:00 road course with one or two slow turns. Those same 3 pts might be used for an airdam that's only worth .5s on the same course. Thus, the LSD is the better choice. Those braces have to be pretty damn magical to equal the lap time decrease of an OS Giken over and open diff. Get the idea?

You have to know your car, and the tracks you will optimize for.
Definitely. Unfortunately, my spidey sense isn't as well developed as some of you on the forum.

Do I want to build a nationally competitive TT car? Nah, but if I go hit tracks in the TX or Midwest regions, I'd like to at least be reasonably competitive with manly driving vs just getting slaughtered.

In reality, I see myself doing 3-5 TT events a year, then spending the rest of my time at my local track, Hallett, for HPDE.

So essentially, I'd want to optimize the car for Hallett. You've been here, willing to give any direction for a TTD car with the idea of making it most competitive at Hallett?

I'm really starting to question if I should just slap some cheap suspension and brakes back on the car, pull off some of the parts worth selling. Then looking for a ratty VVT car.
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Old 08-01-2013, 08:37 PM   #56
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Hallett is bumpy so gotta have shocks and springs. Sway bars not so much. Aero helps but so many low speed turns means it's less critical there too. Lotsa low and mid speed turns with 4 slow corner exits means torque and gearing should be optimized. Aero only helps in T1 and to a lesser extent, the Bitch.

So I would aim for highest torque/weight ratio, best shocks/springs, softest compound you can afford, LSD and a 4.3. Ditch aero, bracing, sway bars.
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Old 08-01-2013, 09:46 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
Hallett is bumpy so gotta have shocks and springs. Sway bars not so much. Aero helps but so many low speed turns means it's less critical there too. Lotsa low and mid speed turns with 4 slow corner exits means torque and gearing should be optimized. Aero only helps in T1 and to a lesser extent, the Bitch.

So I would aim for highest torque/weight ratio, best shocks/springs, softest compound you can afford, LSD and a 4.3. Ditch aero, bracing, sway bars.
Hmm, I've already got your sway setup sitting in the garage ready to go on the car, and once TSE gets the new lightweight rear brake kit, I plan on ordering:
XIDAs 700/400
SuperMiata 11" fronts, TSE 10" rears for the brakes

I'll work on getting the Giken next winter and take a VVT and deck the head and call it good.

Thanks for the advice.
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Old 08-02-2013, 01:42 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by z31maniac View Post
Hmm, I've already got your sway setup sitting in the garage ready to go on the car, and once TSE gets the new lightweight rear brake kit, I plan on ordering:
XIDAs 700/400
SuperMiata 11" fronts, TSE 10" rears for the brakes

I'll work on getting the Giken next winter and take a VVT and deck the head and call it good.

Thanks for the advice.
Brakes will feel amazing but maybe not the best use of PT points for a sprint or TT car.
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Old 08-02-2013, 09:30 AM   #59
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Brakes will feel amazing but maybe not the best use of PT points for a sprint or TT car.
Yeah, you have mentioned that before. But the feel, weight, increased longevity makes +2 I'm OK with.

2 related questions.
1. Any idea how much you could deck the stock VVT head, if keeping the stock cams?
2. How many useful heat cycles can I expect out of a set of R6s?
a. Would 225/45 R6s be worth the extra 6 points over 205s?
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Old 08-02-2013, 12:50 PM   #60
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mmmm I like this thread.
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