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Old 05-30-2011, 10:44 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by Freaky Roadster View Post
Two options for the white crust are coolant or soap from oil. The latter most likely coming from valve stem seals. Are you losing oil at all ???

Thinking about COPS, would you benefit from plugs with a higher temp range?
No oil loss, no smoke whatsoever. In certain conditions I see some vapor from the exhaust at idle.

Ive run those plugs with cops for a long time, I'd probably be better off with BKR6Es, but whatever.

I just realized those plugs are gapped too low, I didn't get the -11s so these will be gapped closer to .030 than .040.


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Assuming it will idle, what happens when you turn off your startup enrichments? Everything but the short-decay enrichments.
havent tried, unsure. Probably read for reals lean. When I cruise I still hit the cells at run my at 15.5:1 with no problem.
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Are your AIT, CLT reading ok?

What happens when you go in boost? Is AFR aok in boost? Does it lean up?
pretty normal in those regards. I try to stay out of boost for the most part right now.

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Long lazy shot: is there juice on the top of your pistons if you shine a light down the spark plug hole?
nope all four look the same, all black and gunky.

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bottom fuel injector seal affecting one cylinder and causing a partial vacuum leak?
no leaks there.


I'll read my narrowband voltage at idle today or tomorrow....been lazy.
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Old 06-01-2011, 11:34 AM   #82
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Just read this on MSextra. I haven't looked into it yet. Any thoughts?

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The last few times I've had unstable idle, I've found my opening time (MS2Extra code) was not long enough. Once the opening time is correct, cars seem much less sensitive to VE tuning at idle. When oscillating, if you watch it rev, you'll see AFR lean out even though the pw doesn't seem to change that much. I think the PW gets to a small enough value that the injector output becomes non-linear (not what is predicted by fueling equation).

I've been out of the loop on this topic as I've been super busy this spring and getting married in less than 2 weeks...
Nevermind, I think this is referring to the injector open time, I though it was referring to the idle valve. Any headway on your problem. I'm amazed out how your description of the problem is identical to what I am experiencing.
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Old 06-01-2011, 11:58 AM   #83
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I'm pretty sure I've tried a 1.6ms deadtime then altering the req_fuel to get back to the AFR I was at prior...no avail.

and no update, ive been lazy.

idled like **** today with the a/c on. kept going from 13.5-16:1 AFR, I didn't have my laptop, but I know those cells were tuned and generally hold a pretty stable VE%.

I know this fuel map is good, and I drove on it for months without any tuning between March and April. I only had to fine tune some fuleing once I added the 255HP since it altered my fuel pressures. But none of my enrichments were touched and the idle cells were always perfect. If anything, there shouldn't be this notiable delay between when I touch the throttle and when the car moves...I'm finding myself blipping the throttle like crazy then releasing the clutch.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:09 PM   #84
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I'm pretty sure I've tried a 1.6ms deadtime then altering the req_fuel to get back to the AFR I was at prior...no avail.

and no update, ive been lazy.

idled like **** today with the a/c on. kept going from 13.5-16:1 AFR, I didn't have my laptop, but I know those cells were tuned and generally hold a pretty stable VE%.

I know this fuel map is good, and I drove on it for months without any tuning between March and April. I only had to fine tune some fuleing once I added the 255HP since it altered my fuel pressures. But none of my enrichments were touched and the idle cells were always perfect. If anything, there shouldn't be this notiable delay between when I touch the throttle and when the car moves...I'm finding myself blipping the throttle like crazy then releasing the clutch.
I don't know if this makes a difference, but I started having the same throttle issue. I thought my throttle cable had stretched. Could this be code related? It's to the point that I tried to adjust my throttle cable to take up any slack, but then I found that there wasn't any slack to take up. Have you tried going back to a different code version? It seems like I can tune out the need for a throttle blip off idle with AE, but then I can tell the AE is not right during normal driving.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:13 PM   #85
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Yeah, I'm running an alpha now that no one else is having the same issue with. I went back to a previous, and even the last "stable". Same thing.

But about the deadtime, it does appear that the PW output reporting does not include the deadtime, so I could see how that could effect someone when not setup properly. But I've been using these at the same deadtime for 4 years.



you are running seq. fuel right? how lean can you make it go before all hell breaks loose? I'm not talking oh its not as stable, I'm talking uncontrollable. But really, there should be no reason I should be reporting 13.5ish at idle at 160*F after my warmup enrichments are done and then see 11.9:1 once I reach 185F. at the same engine map, same injector pw, and same rpm without something else ******* up the mixture.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:41 PM   #86
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Yeah, I'm running an alpha now that no one else is having the same issue with. I went back to a previous, and even the last "stable". Same thing.

But about the deadtime, it does appear that the PW output reporting does not include the deadtime, so I could see how that could effect someone when not setup properly. But I've been using these at the same deadtime for 4 years.



you are running seq. fuel right? how lean can you make it go before all hell breaks loose? I'm not talking oh its not as stable, I'm talking uncontrollable. But really, there should be no reason I should be reporting 13.5ish at idle at 160*F after my warmup enrichments are done and then see 11.9:1 once I reach 185F. at the same engine map, same injector pw, and same rpm without something else ******* up the mixture.
I've had it idle steady at 16.0:1, then for no rhyme or reason the MAP value will change by two points and it sends the car into an unrecoverable oscillation. +/- 2.5 AFR points. I have to flash the ecu so the rpms shoot up and then slowly return to target. It happens much less often when I tune to 13.5:1, but it will still occur. It is very sensitive to a couple of point change in MAP value. It will sit there idling fine, then goes haywire. I wonder if raising or lowering the MAP sampling would help even out the small changes in MAP.

You could always throw in a couple of those radiator pellets and see if you notice a change. I occasionally get a little vapor at idle on startup and a bit of spray out of the exhaust, but I don't have any coolant loss from the radiator when I open it up. I'm wondering if the mist and moisture I'm getting is condensation in the exhaust system.
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Old 06-01-2011, 12:50 PM   #87
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acutally that does sound like mine. what are these pellets you speak of?
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Old 06-01-2011, 01:06 PM   #88
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Before I get flamed because these stop up heater cores and radiators> Everyone who thinks this can eat a dick. I've been running them in my system for 7 months. My coolant temps are excellent, no gunk, heater works, etc.



These are apparently used in new vehicles from some manufacturers to stop small head gasket leaks.

I swear I noticed a change in my idle within five minutes the first time I dropped these in. The idle completely smoothed out. This is what led me to believe I have some sort of small coolant leak that must seal as the engine heats up. It seemed fine for a little while, then the weird idle came back after a day of boost PID tuning.
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Old 06-01-2011, 01:14 PM   #89
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I'm probably going to be replacing the HG just for sanities sake. Might as well drop one in and see if there's an improvement in the meantime then I'd know for sure.

I do have a slight coolant leak that I cannot pinpoint. I can't see any exhaust smoke/vapor, only condinsation for the most part, but I'm probably running 90% water.

Honestly, I just need to do a leakdown test. Which I could do if I drove the car to my parents about 25 miles away, but I'm too lazy and cheap to do that. That's almost $10 in gas!
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Old 06-01-2011, 01:20 PM   #90
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I'm probably going to be replacing the HG just for sanities sake. Might as well drop one in and see if there's an improvement in the meantime then I'd know for sure.

I do have a slight coolant leak that I cannot pinpoint. I can't see any exhaust smoke/vapor, only condinsation for the most part, but I'm probably running 90% water.

Honestly, I just need to do a leakdown test. Which I could do if I drove the car to my parents about 25 miles away, but I'm too lazy and cheap to do that. That's almost $10 in gas!
The white flake on your plugs is surprising if you are running 90% water. I haven't done a leakdown test. I've been dreading a HG change. I'm wondering if I can remove the CAS and pull the head with the intake manifold, exhaust manifold, and turbo still attached?
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Old 06-01-2011, 01:23 PM   #91
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That was my plan. I've done it that way before, just need someone to help lift....or a engine hoist works



thats the only part I dred, is lifting it off without help. Everything else is simple, I can have it ready to pull off probably within 30 minutes.

intake coupers takes a minute.
fuel lines take a minute.
unplgging the cop connectors and fuel harness is seconds.
draining the rad will take a few minutes, removing the upper hose is a seconds.
valve cover bolts and head bolts will take 5-10 minutes.
whats left? the exhaust? I'll either remove the manifold or just the DP...thats going to take the longest. I can pull the turbo in 10 mintes, I've timed that before...but i'd rather just do the DP.


I'll jus tbe pissed to find it was my IM gasket leaking coolant into the runners or something stupid. But I still dont know why my compression test is good and my coolant presusre test passed as well....although the last HG that failed did the same. leakdown instantly showed bubbles in the radiator. and the car overheated as soon as I drove it.
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Old 06-01-2011, 02:13 PM   #92
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Do you have any stock injectors around to try?
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Old 06-01-2011, 02:14 PM   #93
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my blue tops no, just y8s purple 240s that I DID try running them at ~60psi.

I've since removed them and my afpr.
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Old 06-01-2011, 02:19 PM   #94
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Try bypassing the TB water lines. That would be a quick test. A couple of rubber caps, a short length of hose and a couple barbs. I never thought about this. Would it be easy to tell by pulling off the top half of the intake manifold on a 99?
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Old 06-01-2011, 02:21 PM   #95
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I dont even have those lines in place.

there are two places it could leak in a 90-93: there's a galley between 3 & 4 and 1 & 2
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Old 06-01-2011, 02:23 PM   #96
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I dont even have those lines in place.

there are two places it could leak in a 90-93: there's a galley between 3 & 4 and 1 & 2
Would you mind pointing those out? I'll try to investigate on mine. 90-93 TB, 99 intake with FM adapter, I have a 99 head as well.
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Old 06-01-2011, 02:28 PM   #97
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Old 06-02-2011, 08:47 PM   #98
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I siphoned a little coolant out of my rad to run a half treatment of stop leak.

while i was i burped in the system I turned my makeshift siphon into a makeshift stethoscope. Inj 4 does not sound like the rest, it has a distinctly different clicking hertz rate and tone. im checking my ms3 outputs now on my stim, maybe I have a bad injector? Would probably do what's happening.

but then why would the issue happen with the 240s?
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Old 06-02-2011, 11:34 PM   #99
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I siphoned a little coolant out of my rad to run a half treatment of stop leak.

while i was i burped in the system I turned my makeshift siphon into a makeshift stethoscope. Inj 4 does not sound like the rest, it has a distinctly different clicking hertz rate and tone. im checking my ms3 outputs now on my stim, maybe I have a bad injector? Would probably do what's happening.

but then why would the issue happen with the 240s?
update update update ..........
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Old 06-03-2011, 12:21 AM   #100
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but then why would the issue happen with the 240s?
Injector wiring or signal.
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