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Old 05-01-2013, 08:03 AM   #181
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I donno. I haven't actively lifted legs in years. I like being able to wear pants. If I do legs for a couple months, loose fitting pants start to become skin tight on my thighs and I end up wearing like size 38 and taking up massive slack with a belt.
I have this problem. I was blessed with my mom's hips If I actively lift with my legs they become huge. It was great when I was playing soccer because I could run fast and kick the ball like a pro but now it just makes finding jeans or dress pants a pain in the *** because they are cut for normal men.

EDIT: Week 2 update - Lost another two pounds without working out. My last final is today so I will be hitting the gym again after a short vacation. Then the inches should start coming off again.
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Old 05-01-2013, 10:51 AM   #182
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I have this problem. I was blessed with my mom's hips If I actively lift with my legs they become huge. It was great when I was playing soccer because I could run fast and kick the ball like a pro but now it just makes finding jeans or dress pants a pain in the *** because they are cut for normal men.

EDIT: Week 2 update - Lost another two pounds without working out. My last final is today so I will be hitting the gym again after a short vacation. Then the inches should start coming off again.
Don't skip leg day man...c'mon. At least do full body leg work, like deadlifts... that shouldn't make your legs too big and is a great all around lift.

What, specifically, is your diet? Low carbs, high quality fats, high quality proteins? No caloric target, right? I read back through all the pages, and wasn't positive which track you were taking.

I'm the OP, and would like to ask a couple of follow up questions. They are completed unrelated to each other.

1) Energy Drinks - SUGAR IS BAD. I get that. But what about things like Monster Zero? No sugar (Sucralose). Granted, it has a lot of things in it that end with -xine, -trate, and -ide. Decent (synthetic) vitamins and lots of caffeine. Thoughts?

2) Cardio - I mean in the generic sense of the word, that is, an exercise that is designed to engage and exhaust your cardiovascular system. To me, cardio is bad word. When I think cardio I think "running" or "jogging"...two things that I absolutely despise. Chalk it up to my wicked ADD, but when I'm running for the sake of cardio, all I can think about is all of the things that I'd rather be doing. That leads to absolute destruction of motivation, and I never stick to a cardio regimen.

Interval training, HIIT, or whatever the cool new buzzword is different. HIIT is designed to blast your system, get your heart rate really high in short bursts, leading to a shorter workout. Definitely something I can get behind as there's not enough time for my ADD to kick in.

Anyone have any experience with both? Can anyone provide a realworld comparison? The common internet addage is to compare the body of a sprinter (representing HIIT) to the body of a long distance runner (generic hours-long cardio). Maybe that's a good analogy...maybe not.

Thoughts? I lift on a structured basis, but I have way too much body fat. Need to adjust the diet and maybe cycle in some cardio.
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Old 05-01-2013, 10:57 AM   #183
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I am eating low carbs and sugar with high quality fats and lots of vegetables. I am not counting calories but I am making sure I do not over eat. I am never really overly hungry though and I have been going without meals or anything to eat for 7 to 8 hour stretches the past week due to finals.

I do not ignore my legs completely but I do not lift to build muscle in them specifically. I run on an incline and I am also picking back up the dirt bike which after a long day of woops really gets the legs burning.
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Old 05-01-2013, 11:00 AM   #184
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Energy drinks with zero carbs fall into the diet soda regime of using sugar alcohols to replace real sugar with something that kind of tastes like sugar. Skip it. If you need the caffeine but dont like coffee, buy stay alert gum from amazon. Its WAY cheaper than the equivalent amount of energy drinks, and is literally really terrible tasting gum with like 4 cups of coffee worth of caffeine in it, yes it has 2 grams of sugar in it, big deal. Great for pulling those all nighers or trying to not fall asleep at your desk at work after being in the machine shop till 2am last night.
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Old 05-01-2013, 11:28 AM   #185
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1) Energy Drinks - SUGAR IS BAD. I get that. But what about things like Monster Zero? No sugar (Sucralose). Granted, it has a lot of things in it that end with -xine, -trate, and -ide. Decent (synthetic) vitamins and lots of caffeine. Thoughts?
I wouldn't touch any of the processed artificial sweeteners. Basically the only sweeteners I use now are raw honey and stevia. Green tea with a bit of raw honey or stevia mixed in would make a good natural energy drink. I mean real green tea, not something that comes in a Lipton's bottle at the gas station.

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2) Cardio - I mean in the generic sense of the word, that is, an exercise that is designed to engage and exhaust your cardiovascular system. To me, cardio is bad word. When I think cardio I think "running" or "jogging"...two things that I absolutely despise. Chalk it up to my wicked ADD, but when I'm running for the sake of cardio, all I can think about is all of the things that I'd rather be doing. That leads to absolute destruction of motivation, and I never stick to a cardio regimen.

Interval training, HIIT, or whatever the cool new buzzword is different. HIIT is designed to blast your system, get your heart rate really high in short bursts, leading to a shorter workout. Definitely something I can get behind as there's not enough time for my ADD to kick in.

Anyone have any experience with both? Can anyone provide a realworld comparison? The common internet addage is to compare the body of a sprinter (representing HIIT) to the body of a long distance runner (generic hours-long cardio). Maybe that's a good analogy...maybe not.

Thoughts? I lift on a structured basis, but I have way too much body fat. Need to adjust the diet and maybe cycle in some cardio.
Cardio as a category isn't bad, it's just how most people do cardio that's really screwed up. We've been trained to think that exercising longer is better, so we exercise as long as we can. Low-intensity cardio (walking, hiking) doesn't feel like it's doing enough, and high-intensity cardio (fast running, hill runs) is too hard to do for a long time, so people end up doing hours of medium-intensity cardio just for the sake of doing it, greasing the groove for minimal improvement and mediocre performance, not to mention wearing down their adrenal system, creating inflammation, and depressing the immune system.

So unless you are training for a specific event that involves a certain amount of endurance cardio, there's no good reason to spend an hour on a treadmill.

For the vast majority of people, HIIT will offer as much or more improvement without overstressing your body. I like sprints and hill runs, and also mix in a few HIIT workouts involving things like burpees and kettlebell swings. Nothing, absolutely nothing, can kick my *** like kettlebells -- with an appropriately-sized KB, doing 2-handed swings for 20 minutes with a 45-second on, 15 second-off pattern will get me to the near-puking moment if I'm really pushing hard. I play a couple sports per week that involve intermittent sprinting. My "endurance" cardio is just once a week -- I do a hill run with a local group -- half mile up the hill, do some burpees or pushups or jump squats, half mile down the hill. Four total round trips for 4 miles, but it takes nearly an hour what with the breaks and other exercises.

That's my recommendation. Build your workout plan around activities that you enjoy, adjust those activities to fit your goals. Get your diet right, make your workouts efficient, and you'll see much better results.
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Old 05-01-2013, 01:00 PM   #186
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Anyone have any experience with both? Can anyone provide a realworld comparison? The common internet addage is to compare the body of a sprinter (representing HIIT) to the body of a long distance runner (generic hours-long cardio). Maybe that's a good analogy...maybe not.
I feel strongly that doing 60 days of Insanity (which I would consider HIIT) built my cardio and muscle endurance up much better than just going out and jogging regularly. My wife felt the same way regarding her cardio endurance.

The same was true of my Muay Thai training, which I would also consider a form of HIIT.

One thing I do when I jog is use an app that measures my distance and time and gives me audio updates of my pace. Like with motorsports, competition motivates me - either against the clock or someone I'm with.


I hate jogging on the treadmill, so I use a type of interval for my warmup. I might only jog for 5 minutes instead of 20-30, but I change the speed and/or incline every 30-60 seconds until I'm running and then bring it back down.

For what it's worth, I'm in a slightly different boat from most of the posters in this thread as I'm more of a "lean gainer." I think Mark might be closer to that end of the spectrum. Right now, I'm working on increasing my strength, so I am starting a "StongLifts" style program.



That said, I am a little guy and only run about an 8.5 minute mile (for a 5K pace) so whatever VoM is doing to be running 7.5 minute miles must be working.
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Old 05-01-2013, 01:16 PM   #187
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For what it's worth, I'm in a slightly different boat from most of the posters in this thread as I'm more of a "lean gainer." I think Mark might be closer to that end of the spectrum.
Yup. 5'10", 150ish lbs, 12% body fat. Extremely difficult for me to lose or gain weight (though shifting from a SAD to Paleo-style diet cut a lot of body fat for me).
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Old 05-01-2013, 01:28 PM   #188
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so whatever VoM is doing to be running 7.5 minute miles must be working.
HIIT.

I do a surprisingly little amount of cardio, I just do what is necessary and effective. When I first started to get back in shape I did Insanity and the cardio results were ludicrous (lost 30lbs in two months, too). I still do Insanity, but on my off weeks when I need a break from the gym.

Now I lift weights in a cardio "style". I do drop-sets for the first set of each lift and then 6-8 reps of heavy weight for two sets with a 30 second break. I'm drenched in sweat and my heart rate is up/down the entire time.

I do HIIT on the treadmill immediately after I'm done lifting. Set controls to Manual Mode with the incline set at 4. 2:00 medium walk, 2:00 minutes quick jog; 1:30 walk, :30 sprint. I usually repeat this for around 13-15 minutes and mix up the order and times depending on how I feel. The main thing is having your heart rate shoot way up and bring it back down. You'll notice your cardio/endurance improving and adjust your speed/times to keep it challenging.

After that short time on the treadmill, I am exhausted. I mean, dead. I'll have a trail of sweat running down my hands from under my hoodie and sweat stains showing all over.
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Old 05-01-2013, 04:24 PM   #189
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Yup. 5'10", 150ish lbs, 12% body fat. Extremely difficult for me to lose or gain weight (though shifting from a SAD to Paleo-style diet cut a lot of body fat for me).
Buy protein powder, 2 scoops in the morning on ur way to work or whatever, 2 after the gym. at least 1 Chicken breast and 2 boiled potatoes for lunch and dinner (breakfast too if u can do it) You'll gain weight in no time.

Before i started working i was 135... now i'm 175 at 7% and cutting. (5'7") I started cutting at 180, i've dropped down 3% body fat and kept just about all the weight. This is coming from someone that also cant gain weight... i was 110-120 in high school.
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Old 05-01-2013, 04:27 PM   #190
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Buy protein powder, 2 scoops in the morning on ur way to work or whatever, 2 after the gym. at least 1 Chicken breast and 2 boiled potatoes for lunch and dinner (breakfast too if u can do it) You'll gain weight in no time.

Before i started working i was 135... now i'm 175 at 7% and cutting. (5'7") I started cutting at 180, i've dropped down 3% body fat and kept just about all the weight.
Not really interested in gaining weight. I'd like to be about as fit as possible at my most easily-maintainable natural body weight.
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Old 05-01-2013, 04:43 PM   #191
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I hate how people use protein powder. I only use powder if I feel my protein intake is low on that day.

On a side note, this guy is a bad ***.
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:23 PM   #192
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Do you eat 150 grams of protein every day? If so nice, i dont.
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:24 PM   #193
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I eat so much protein it's insane.
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:34 PM   #194
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Theres about 20 grams in chicken breasts.. about 10 in potatoes. That would make a lot of food for me to eat to get my needed protein.
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Old 05-01-2013, 08:38 PM   #195
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4-5 eggs, a potato, 2 trips of turkey bacon, 2 tortillas, and 3 cups of milk.

That's like 70g protein.

Then if I eat 2 turkey paties that day then that's another 70g.

I really only drink protein shakes when I'm too lazy to make breakfast.

That's 2 scoops, 1 cup oats, 2 tbsp peanut butter, 1.5 cups of milk.
That comes out to around 82g.
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Old 05-01-2013, 09:29 PM   #196
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Nice, now only if i could have one of u to make me breakfast
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Old 05-01-2013, 09:48 PM   #197
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I know right. I hate making food.
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Old 05-01-2013, 11:20 PM   #198
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+1 on HIIT. I do Super High Intensity Interval Trainging ... aka SHIIT. At the end of each intense cycle, I'm breathing so hard I can barely say "****! ****! ****!" while panting.

The way I do it is I cycle/row/whatever really hard until my heart rate touches 170, then I go slow until it drops below 150 .... repeat 8-9x. Usually takes about 14 mins if I do it at the end of a workout.
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:37 AM   #199
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I drink 2L of milk a day, its just a habit, that helps a lot.

Dann
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:59 AM   #200
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I drink 2L of milk a day, its just a habit, that helps a lot.

Dann
Lucky. I wish I could drink milk. But instead I drink vanilla silk soooo good.
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