Hustler's new engine: help him pick parts, ya'll ( a thread for power tops) - Page 3 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Race Prep Miata race-only chat.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-11-2012, 05:14 PM   #41
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by k24madness View Post
As far as piston material are concerned I think the supertech ones are the best. They are a high silicon forging that expands less that other types of forgings (JE etc). This really helps with oil control. Oil control really helps control detonation.

Stock pistons are also high silicon but cast. The only downside is they are weak and more likely to shatter if subjected to detonation.

Maybe I missed it but did something happen to John's motor?
60% leak through the rings on #4.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2012, 07:58 PM   #42
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Wake Forest, NC
Posts: 175
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by k24madness View Post
My original recommendation for a 10:1 piston was due to fuel, Texas summer temps and track conditions.

Rather than try to control detonation by lower compression I would suggest the following. With the below in mind 10:5 or more should be fine.

Add adjustable cam gears. Retarding the intake will bleed off static compression and move the power curve up the rpm band. Take the dyno torque curve and shift it over 250-500 rpms to get an ideal of what i mean.

Dyno/road tune for 91 oct but run race gas blends at the track. 93-95 oct makes a world of difference and is cheap insurance under high heat/lead situations.
I came here to post almost exactly this. I used to do this all the time with my WRX that was tuned on 93 because I found that on the street, I would have no knock, but on the track, the knocklite was lit up like a Christmas tree.

Also, as an alternative to a pimpy clutch setup, have you considered turning down a 1.6 flywheel to lighten it? I cant see that being more than a few bucks at the machine shop.
cucamelsmd15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2012, 10:11 PM   #43
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cucamelsmd15 View Post
I came here to post almost exactly this. I used to do this all the time with my WRX that was tuned on 93 because I found that on the street, I would have no knock, but on the track, the knocklite was lit up like a Christmas tree.

Also, as an alternative to a pimpy clutch setup, have you considered turning down a 1.6 flywheel to lighten it? I cant see that being more than a few bucks at the machine shop.
You guys should seriously consider tuning the engine...um...when the engine is hot. There are some real idiot tuners out there I guess.

I have a fancy, light flywheel as well.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:36 AM   #44
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

I have a dillema, I don't think I want Supertech pistons but I'm kind of an idiot so I don't really know what I'm talking about.
I did some reading last night in bed, with a kitty, and learned that Supertech drops their quenche pads by up to 1.5mm, which is bad. I also do not like the angularity at the piston dome, it's too tall. I am not sure what to think about the "button" at the sparkplug. I'm not sure if that adds mechanical octane, takes it away, slows flame speed, or makes magic:

Look at the drop around the ring land "behind" the quench pad. Why do that? Isn't that going to put more combustion around the outside of the piston, most likely with a not-so-homogenous mixture? Again, I wear a walking helmet, but that doesn't seem like a good thing to me.

The factory 10:1 piston on the right is smoother on the top with less angular junk to hot-spot and divider between valves:

Then, things start looking really good on the Wisecos. No angular hot-spotty edges, smoother face on the dome, and possibly a deeper exhaust valve pocket (burn duration):

Here are the 10:1 JEs from JKav's build. I don't know how I feel about the valve reliefs, don't know if he actually likes those pistons, or if JE is handing out paola. I respect whatever JKav does, I'd be a fool not to...but I want a 10.5 piston since I want to see 160whp:


Then I fould this. FM pistons, those bastards, with their $800 slugs and what I predict is clearly a superior design...however I need a better picture.
The smoothest dome, no valve-separation on the exhaust side, incredibly smooth dome shape, and an offset wrist pin.

Here is their stroker piston, notice how the valve reliefs do not cut into the ring-land area:

Send us a better picture, FM. The problem with this is the price, I don't have an additonal $400 to blow out my *** on pistons, regardless of the reality that they're probably the most important part of the engine, maybe the heart.
Then, the big problem...I found this gem that I saved and I believe it's a Miata piston becuase it's labled as such in my saved pics folder, and Roller Wave is made by Endyne. Look at how deep the valve reliefs are, how smooth the edges are at every angle, and how the dome is biased to one side. ****, I think I want Endyne pistons, but they're probably more expensive than FM.


Right now I'm thinking 10.5:1 is the compression limit for 91 octane for a conventional piston. I could potentially go with the Supertech piston because I think I prefer that less-expeansive material, but Ill have to massage the edges of the piston dome/valve divider thingies and hopefully get compression down from 11 to 10.5. The quench-pad recession bothers me though. The regular Wiseco piston looks like a good choice for $100 more, requires no work, but there are some unknowns that are above my head. The FM piston is $800, at that point why not just send the engine to Endyne and get something fancy? Endyne is a great option, like a dream...but I'm not so sure I want an engine so expensive that I'm afraid to tune it or hang the tach at 7000rpm for the next five years without thinking about the money.

Talk to me, bitches.
Attached Thumbnails
Hustler's new engine: help him pick parts, ya'll ( a thread for power tops)-2001pistoncompare.jpg   Hustler's new engine: help him pick parts, ya'll ( a thread for power tops)-project_miata_long_rod_je_pistons_fsr.jpg  

Last edited by hustler; 12-13-2012 at 11:29 AM.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:41 AM   #45
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Also, if 949, TSE, or FM drop in, please post pics of your pistons so I may crown the king, there can be only one.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:41 AM   #46
Boost Czar
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,847
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

quarters.
Braineack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:48 AM   #47
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Leafy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: NH
Posts: 9,091
Total Cats: 90
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
quarters.
And JB weld.
Leafy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:48 AM   #48
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
quarters.
I have some old Dutch Guilders, will that work?
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:50 AM   #49
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Hey, why don't all you neckbeards come in here and hijack my awesome thread with your tales of heterosexual virginity and intellectual depravity? If you two do this again in here, I'm banning you both.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:51 AM   #50
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,175
Total Cats: 2,576
Default

Here is some real advice: spend as much money as possible. If you spend under 10 grand, you are a bitch and your **** will fail on the 1st day..
Then you will crawl back into my arms and I will make sweet love to you.
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:52 AM   #51
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
Here is some real advice: spend as much money as possible. If you spend under 10 grand, you are a bitch and your **** will fail on the 1st day..
Then you will crawl back into my arms and I will make sweet love to you.
Oh look, the hardparking crew is back to give me advice.

PM me about the warm embrace.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:53 AM   #52
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Leafy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: NH
Posts: 9,091
Total Cats: 90
Default

Hussy, the last piston you posted was very obviously reworked by hand after it was machined. If the angularity of the cheaper pistons worry you bust out the die grinder and clean it up.
Leafy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:54 AM   #53
Boost Czar
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,847
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
Hey, why don't all you neckbeards come in here and hijack my awesome thread with your tales of heterosexual virginity and intellectual depravity? If you two do this again in here, I'm banning you both.
Braineack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:56 AM   #54
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
Hussy, the last piston you posted was very obviously reworked by hand after it was machined. If the angularity of the cheaper pistons worry you bust out the die grinder and clean it up.
I know those Endyne pistons have a better finish on them...do I really have the skill to do that?

Also, I worry that the Supertech pistons have valve reliefs cut into the quench and ring land. That's a big worry for me. I want the most mechanical octane possible.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 10:59 AM   #55
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
It's nice to know that not only is my aweful trolling appreciated here, but it's accepted as a accepted as an endearment or a thank-you.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:04 AM   #56
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Leafy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: NH
Posts: 9,091
Total Cats: 90
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
I know those Endyne pistons have a better finish on them...do I really have the skill to do that?

Also, I worry that the Supertech pistons have valve reliefs cut into the quench and ring land. That's a big worry for me. I want the most mechanical octane possible.
You would be surprised what the inbred nincompoops that work in parts prep with a die grinder do to $10k forgings outside my office. I believe in you.
Leafy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:06 AM   #57
mkturbo.com
iTrader: (24)
 
shuiend's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Charleston SC
Posts: 13,775
Total Cats: 1,106
Default

When do you just ship all of your **** to Savington along with a blank check and then in a couple of weeks get back a complete working motor that is done correctly?
shuiend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:12 AM   #58
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shuiend View Post
When do you just ship all of your **** to Savington along with a blank check and then in a couple of weeks get back a complete working motor that is done correctly?
Because Emilio was faster at Thunderhill. Maybe next year, if Andrew works really hard at driving, he can get my business agian.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:14 AM   #59
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
You would be surprised what the inbred nincompoops that work in parts prep with a die grinder do to $10k forgings outside my office. I believe in you.
  1. I've made liquor
  2. I smoke meat
  3. I like to shoot stuff
That's the trifecta, I'm an inbred necropheliac.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-13-2012, 11:17 AM   #60
Tour de Franzia
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Here's another wrench in the bidet:
Let's say I could get an H-beam rod in any length I wanted for under $400 and a Wiseco with adjusted wrist-pin geometry for $550 and I don't want to rev the car over 7200?

What sayeth the nose breathing classs?
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
elesjuan's mediocre 95 Miata adventure (google fiber edition) elesjuan Build Threads 8 02-16-2016 09:36 PM
TTE Build - Help me pick tires chrisn Race Prep 27 10-16-2015 06:12 PM
Squiblez 1996 Montego blue Squiblez Build Threads 2 09-22-2015 11:17 AM
Project DDoS: '99 "Budget" boost build ProjectDDoS Build Threads 1 09-09-2015 02:52 PM
New here, saying hi, here's what I'm workin with. SuperSneakySecretSquirrel Meet and Greet 5 09-06-2015 09:30 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:25 AM.