Fireindc's attempt to build a decent miata. (the search for more torque). - Page 32 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 02-24-2014, 12:26 PM   #621
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Pull the trigger already!
already did on those parts this morning!
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Old 02-28-2014, 04:14 PM   #622
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What do you guys think about running an 01+ vvt oil pump with my motor? I've done some reading and this should result in a slightly higher oil pressure, which sounds good to me.

Discuss!
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Old 02-28-2014, 04:26 PM   #623
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Can't be a bad thing. I see absolutely no reason NOT to upgrade this part if you plan on spending the money to replace it anyway. My backup/boost motor is a BP4W that was built for (but never used in) a spec miata and has a BP6D oil pump in it. It's had like 45-50k street miles on it before it came into my possession with absolutely no issues.

When my original-to-the-car shortblock gets built, its getting a Boundary or a stock BP6D pump. If I'm feeling saucy I might even stick a shim in it.

I also have a VVT head in the garage. If I get crazy, I might actually use it and I'm not going to run a 6D head and 4W pump AND steal oil for a turbo at the same time. Sounds like bad news.
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Old 02-28-2014, 05:24 PM   #624
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Thanks EO for your input. Another thing on my mind, is there any downside to running "race" bearings on a daily driven car? Should I spring for ACL race bearings, or run OEM/king/clevite/blahlbah standard bearings?

My car is certainly not a "race" car, but it will hopefully see a tiny bit of track time, and definitely lots of street/canyon flogging.
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Old 02-28-2014, 07:21 PM   #625
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No clue on that one. It might be worth asking in the https://www.miataturbo.net/engine-pe...-driver-77340/ therad. I'd go as far as to make the assumption that everyone in that thread who is talking about DD'ing a built motor also has high end bearings in there as well though the commentary seems to be focused on PtW rather than bearings. It was touched on briefly by several people but not fully explained by anyone.

This may be oversimplifying it, but bearings aren't direct contact anyway, right? Use good oil and don't run out of it and it should be fine.

Hopefully someone more experienced can come along and set us "straight"
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Old 03-03-2014, 10:21 PM   #626
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Thanks EO, i posted in that thread to get some feedback hopefully. I'm going to be ordering bearings this week, so unless i read a good reason to run race bearings I think i'm going to go with these kings and give them a shot.

STOKED on my motor build though, the more i read about everything the more it all makes sense.
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Old 03-03-2014, 11:11 PM   #627
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I'd probably stick with OEM bearings, but I'm weird like that and have no really good reasons for this opinion lol

Also agreed on the vvt pump - I'd probably run one. But beware they are quite a bit more expensive.
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Old 03-04-2014, 10:46 AM   #628
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I don't think there's really much of a difference to "race bearings" other than over all quality. I would go with ACL or Clevite or OEM.
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Old 03-04-2014, 12:50 PM   #629
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I'd probably stick with OEM bearings, but I'm weird like that and have no really good reasons for this opinion lol

Also agreed on the vvt pump - I'd probably run one. But beware they are quite a bit more expensive.
hot ****, you are right. The bp6d pump is damn near $300 anywhere i can find it, i'd get the BE street pump before that.

however at this point, in the sake of keeping things "budget" and the possibility that I could fail being my first build ever, i'm going to go with OEM type bearings, OEM 94-00 oil pump, and plain chrome rings.

Thanks for your input guys!
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Old 03-04-2014, 01:19 PM   #630
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small update on the foz, cause whynot. over 1k miles on it, MOST of them going up and down the mountain (i go snowboarding 3x a week). Having a subaru like this is so kickass. I was passing people in a foot of fresh snow up the canyon, all on shitty all seasons. Went through some snow drifts that came over the hood onto the windsheild when plowing through em. Yeah, subaru+miata i think is going to be the perfect combo for me.

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Old 03-04-2014, 02:12 PM   #631
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Holy crap, no kidding! I hadn't realized there was that much of a price difference between the 4W and the 6D. It's like, more than double from Rosenthal.

Also, much jelly of your snow. Push it to the left though, we could use the moisture here in CA.
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Old 03-04-2014, 05:13 PM   #632
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Push it to the left though, we could use the moisture here in CA.
NONONO!! Push it to the right. Need moisture in TX.
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Old 03-04-2014, 05:33 PM   #633
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NONONO!! Push it to the right. Need moisture in TX.
You bastards keep all the good gas for yourselves, you want everything now?
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Old 03-04-2014, 09:07 PM   #634
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Not everything. You guys can keep your public finances.
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Old 03-05-2014, 04:54 PM   #635
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I don't think there's really much of a difference to "race bearings" other than over all quality. I would go with ACL or Clevite or OEM.
There is a difference between RACE bearings and a standard Aluminum, Bi-Metal or a Tri-Metal bearing. Depending on the manufacturers definition it's usually the material or density.

One of the major functions of an engine bearing is to pull foreign material away from the surface of your crankshaft. That's why if you've ever pulled a bearing you'll commonly see small particles pressed into the bearing surface. This means the bearing is doing it's job by protecting the crank surfaces. The bearings ability to pull these particles away from your crank easily will allow for a longer rebuild interval.

A Race bearing is a harder material - my general rule of thumb is if the car does not have a forged crankshaft, do NOT use a Race Bearing. What happens in this situation is the foreign material will enter the journal and instead of being pulled away by a soft non-race bearing it is much more likely to damage the crankshaft.

If you have a 1.8, you're in luck because from the factory the crankshafts are forged. This is why you commonly see builds that include the ACL race bearing package to help with their ability to sustain under higher loads.
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Old 03-05-2014, 06:52 PM   #636
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hot ****, you are right. The bp6d pump is damn near $300 anywhere i can find it, i'd get the BE street pump before that.

however at this point, in the sake of keeping things "budget" and the possibility that I could fail being my first build ever, i'm going to go with OEM type bearings, OEM 94-00 oil pump, and plain chrome rings.

Thanks for your input guys!

It took me a long time (days & months) hovering over the "buy" button for the BE VVT pump. I finally did it and don't regret it. Yes it's lots of money for an oil pump but there is no better and it performs one of the most important tasks.
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Old 03-05-2014, 06:56 PM   #637
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Not everything. You guys can keep your public finances.
Touché
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Old 03-05-2014, 09:07 PM   #638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FAB View Post
There is a difference between RACE bearings and a standard Aluminum, Bi-Metal or a Tri-Metal bearing. Depending on the manufacturers definition it's usually the material or density.

One of the major functions of an engine bearing is to pull foreign material away from the surface of your crankshaft. That's why if you've ever pulled a bearing you'll commonly see small particles pressed into the bearing surface. This means the bearing is doing it's job by protecting the crank surfaces. The bearings ability to pull these particles away from your crank easily will allow for a longer rebuild interval.

A Race bearing is a harder material - my general rule of thumb is if the car does not have a forged crankshaft, do NOT use a Race Bearing. What happens in this situation is the foreign material will enter the journal and instead of being pulled away by a soft non-race bearing it is much more likely to damage the crankshaft.

If you have a 1.8, you're in luck because from the factory the crankshafts are forged. This is why you commonly see builds that include the ACL race bearing package to help with their ability to sustain under higher loads.
A wealth of knowledge here, Thanks!. Seeing as this car is not a dedicated track car, and I likely will have other much weaker links than the bearings (OEM pistons), and I'll be running e85 (less heat overall), I think I'll stick with OEM style bearings for my DD mild engine build.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Landrew View Post
It took me a long time (days & months) hovering over the "buy" button for the BE VVT pump. I finally did it and don't regret it. Yes it's lots of money for an oil pump but there is no better and it performs one of the most important tasks.
If i was going full forged there would be no doubts about buying the BE pump, or the ACL race bearings for that matter. At this point I'm going to stick with the plan of a "budget" build on this block and try to keep it sub $1,000. I'll tally the cost of everything once i get it running and let you guys know
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Old 03-07-2014, 11:33 AM   #639
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So I went ahead and pulled the trigger on the King bearings, i'll experiment with them for you guys

Also, about to pull the trigger on rings/headgasket/oil pump. Rings, i'm going with the "premium" total seal chrome rings on rockauto for $100, headgasket I'm going with the felpro MLS for $50 (had good luck on my scoob, lots of people swear by em), and for the oil pump It's up in the air still and I need guidance.

I'd rather have OEM over anything, but i cannot for the life of me find a good deal on an OEM one. Honestly if I'm paying $150 for an oem one, i may as well bite the bullet and go BE. however, if i can get an oem one for sub $100 or so, i'll do that. On rockauto there are:

ITM ENGINE COMPONENTS for $70
and
DNJ ENGINE COMPONENTS for $80

Are either of these going to be good enough for my build? What do you guys think?
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Old 03-07-2014, 11:37 AM   #640
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I've used a TON of ITM parts over the years. Never had a problem with a single one.
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