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Old 04-01-2014, 10:24 AM   #81
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That sucks man! I have them in stock if you need it quickly. It seems like Winters last stab at making Michigan miserable for us east coast guys.
PM sent. If you can get it to me sooner than this Thu (without crazy-stupid shipping) then I'll order.
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Old 04-01-2014, 10:28 AM   #82
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To add to this - The Bose amp does use a high level input.. Just replace the amp with a cheap 4 channel (probably way stronger than the factory) and pick up an audio jack. That way you can upgrade your speakers down the road.
I thought about that, but I'm stuck with the sucky Bose speakers (with the stupidly-low resistance) for the short-term and I don't want to get an amp to accommodate them now and then have to get a different one later. I figure that I'll get the "hook-up" for the tablet right first then do the amp and speakers in a big-bang later.
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Old 04-01-2014, 01:29 PM   #83
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OK...I'm seriously considering blasphemy, so those with sensitive eyes...LOOK AWAY NOW!

Since it's gonna be Thursday or Friday before my new PLX arrives, I'm considering plugging in the stock ECU and turning down the boost until it arrives. I mean, I ran that way (with the DooDoo box as a band-aid) for over a year, how much harm can 2-3 (or more) days cause?

The alternative is missing the first week of truly nice weather in "PT Cruiser Hell"!

What say you?

WWmt.netD
("What Would mt.net Do?")
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Old 04-01-2014, 02:06 PM   #84
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Can you get a AEM UEGO or MTX-L locally? You can have one in 2 days via Amazon Prime if that's your thing

Did PLX say anything about the self-destruction?
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Old 04-01-2014, 02:12 PM   #85
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Hey I actually don't have access to PLX. I shot them a note but for now I'm afraid I can't do that quickly. I do have the AEM in stock and can have it to you tomorrow though. Let me know what you come up with.
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Old 04-01-2014, 02:33 PM   #86
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Can you get a AEM UEGO or MTX-L locally? You can have one in 2 days via Amazon Prime if that's your thing

Did PLX say anything about the self-destruction?
Summit has the UEGO in stock, but I'd prefer the PLX b'cause I'm already wired up for it.

The failure is my own fault. I had the controller under the driver seat and my fabricated sliders for the Sparco seat managed to slice through the power lead and short it out. What kinda bugs me is that I shorted the controller instead of popping a fuse.

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Hey I actually don't have access to PLX. I shot them a note but for now I'm afraid I can't do that quickly. I do have the AEM in stock and can have it to you tomorrow though. Let me know what you come up with.
Like I said...I'd prefer a PLX, but PM me a price w/ shipping to Atlanta and we'll see. I've got an order in-hand, but don't have a tracking number (yet) so I'll RMA it back if necessary (or you'll see a "sell" of a new, in the box PLX SM-AFR combo soon).
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Old 04-02-2014, 10:31 AM   #87
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Ok, let the weirdness begin...

Last night I plugged the stock ECU back in, expecting to fire it up and go on about my business. But when I started the car it chugged like a train and barely would idle. I disconnected the Voodoo Box with the same effect.

WTF!!!

So I plugged the PLX and the MS back in, just to see what would happen. And - wait for it - the damned thing started and ran just fine.

WTF!!

I took the car out, fully expecting that the AFR readings would go berserk again. But 20 minutes later, everything was good. So good that I put in some initial settings for PID-based EGO control and took it out to verify the settings.

Even this morning the car started and ran like a champ.

I'm going to keep the new box, it has some good features that will be useful and I certainly need the AFR gauge (the Innovate gauge I currently have has a different calibration than the PLX and gives "off" readings). So this isn't a loss, but it sure is a PITA.

Thinking about the whole "why didn't the stock ECU run" problem and I came up with this...I forgot that I had installed the 650 cc injectors and the stock ECU can't handle them, so it goes bananas. That's my theory and I'm sticking with it.

The downside of that is that I have to swap the stock injectors in when it comes time for emissions testing (cause I need the OBD connector active). That's a pain, but 1 week of crap for 51 weeks of joy is a win.

Last edited by rwyatt365; 04-03-2014 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 04-03-2014, 09:25 AM   #88
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Two day w/ the old PLX controller in, and the car is running fine. The new one will delivered today and it'll go in this weekend.

I haven't forgotten about the tablet, I'll be making some inroads with that (hopefully) this weekend as well.
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Old 04-07-2014, 09:50 AM   #89
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This weekend was a royal PITA!! Two steps forward, and three steps back...

I got the new PLX in on Thursday and started bright and early on Saturday (I waited 'cause I could get to a climate-controlled garage, with a lift then) to install it. If you're not interested in the gory details, I've got a question down at Problem #3

Problem #1 I couldn't get access to the "big" lift (the one with the arms that swing under the car and can lift it high enough to stand up under it and work), so I had to use the scissor lift (the one like a giant scissor jack, but only lifts the car up with about 4 feet of clearance underneath - better than jack stands, but not exactly comfortable to work under).

So, after fumbling around trying to figure out the locking mechanism, I got the car up in the air and (finally) got the WBO2 sensor out of the bung (damn you rust!). When I got the wiring for the sensor out, I found this;



Evidently, the wires contacted the exhaust pipe and melted. Inside the flex-tube were several wires that looked like this;



This one was the power for the heater on the WBO2. I'm certain that it had shorted to the exhaust (or another wire) and was causing problems. So - in my infinite wisdom - I had some heat-wrap on hand to make sure that this didn't happen with the new wiring.

Problem #2 I got the new controller wired up, the new harness encased in heat wrap and the harness secured (with metal ties) away from the exhaust. I plugged in the new controller and AFR gauge and turned on the ignition to see if everything worked...and it was pegged at 20:1!!!

WTF, did they sell me a defective controller?! I turned everything off and started checking wires - everything seemed fine. I plugged in the old controller and...it was pegged at 20:1??? Did I blow out something? I checked fuses, I checked everything I could think of...nothing.

OK...calm down...what can I do? Well, I can scrap the PLX and go to a local supplier and get an AEM, but first I have to get the car running (no one else is here and I'm 20 miles from home and access to another car). AHA! I have the old injectors around, I can put them in and plug in the stock ECU and get where I need to get. BUT...the FIC 650's have a different connector than stock and I don't have an old wiring harness around. NOOOOOOoooooo!!!

So I have to do SOMETHING to get the car running as-is. I rummage around the shop and find an old DVM, but the battery in it is almost dead. But it's good enough to read voltages, and I can tell a short from an open - good enough. I start tracing wires on the controller and find out...wait for it...that I had forgotten to secure a ground wire stupid rookie mistake! It didn't take long to get everything back together and the car running but it was 2PM (I was supposed to be done at 11AM), so I packed up and headed home.

Problem #3 The car is running fine, the AFR's are reasonable, the gauge is showing what Shadow Dash is registering (great tool BTW) and I'm happy. I'm cruising down the hwy at (supra-legal) speed, enjoying life when I get a little "cough" from the engine. WTF, it's never done that before? It's only a little thing, and it settles down. Then a few minutes later, it does it again only this time, more so. I look at the AFR gauge and it's starting to go crazy, creeping up to full lean. But when I look at Shadow Dash it's showing almost full-rich (11, 10.9, readings like that). So I back out of it and coast for a few seconds and gingerly reapply throttle and the readings are almost normal until there's another "cough".

So I get off the hwy and pull into a parking lot and shut down expecting to see mechanical mayhem, but all seems well under the hood. So I re-start and continue home on surface streets and the car is like, "Hey dude, what's all the fuss. I'm fine, why you stressin'?"

I've been on the hwy before (with the old controller/WBO2 and some earlier settings) going at the same (or higher) speeds, for a longer time and haven't experienced anything like this before. The most significant change (IMO) is that I've engaged EGO PID control just before all of the "controller madness" (settings below). Could this be my problem?



I've even got a log that captures the event (starts after 4315 sec - Shadow Dash doesn't have a "mark" function that I know of). Any help would be welcome (I'll add it in an edit - waiting for Dropbox to sync and I have a meeting I have to go to).
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Last edited by rwyatt365; 04-07-2014 at 11:37 AM. Reason: Adding log
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Old 04-07-2014, 11:49 AM   #90
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I can't seem to get the MSL to upload, so I put it into Dropbox. Hopefully those that are interested can get to is via this link.
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Old 04-08-2014, 09:34 AM   #91
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There was torrential rain yesterday so I didn't try out my newest settings - I'll try that tonight (I hope). The changes I made were;

- Turn off EGO PID and revert to "Simple" EGO control
- Go back to an earlier spark map (not much different than the one posted earlier, about a 0.5* advance between 3-4K at 100kPa)
- Re-tuned the WUE - the previous starts were really rich and would barely idle during warmup

This ha BETTER work!
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Old 04-15-2014, 01:47 PM   #92
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Update:

- Went back to Simple EGO control...no difference
- Went back to earlier spark map...no difference

I took a hard look at the last log file I got during this madness and saw that (when I think I was experiencing one of those "moments" - as I said, Shadow Dash doesn't have a mark function) I'm in a steady state cruise situation when the PW starts to sag and the AFR reading starts to climb to full-lean, that's when the RPM's start to fluctuate and the MAP starts to fall. I get out of the throttle and - after a few seconds - everything starts to recover. There are several of these "moments" in the logfile, but the first one starts around 1228 seconds.

Things to try...

1) It's time for my annual GA "emissions test" so I put the stock injectors back in and plugged the stock ECU back in (of course, the DooDoo box is back in and the boost is turned down), so I'm going to use this opportunity to see how the car runs "stock". This will be my baseline. If it runs fine, then I know that there isn't a system problem beyond the MS. If not...time to go to "Diagnosis-ville".

2) After the inspection; plug in the MS, change REQ_FUEL and see what I have (the classic A/B Test). If I'm good then on to step 3. If not...find out what is causing the problem).

3) Re-install the FIC injectors and diagnose...

This was supposed to be EASY

Last edited by rwyatt365; 04-18-2014 at 08:46 AM. Reason: can't get MSL to upload
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Old 04-18-2014, 09:03 AM   #93
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Step 1 (almost) complete.
  • Stock Injectors back in
  • Stock ECU re-connected
  • Went to get emissions test, but...

FAILED! Even though the CEL didn't come on, the ECU reported two codes; P0171 (too lean bank 1) and P0705 (Transmission range selector circuit malfunction). The "too lean" can be dealt with through driving technique - been there, done that. But the P0705 generated an immediate WTF!!

First of all, a crappy neutral safety switch (NSS) on the transmission is EMISSIONS RELATED?! WTF, Georgia? Are you kidding me! A bit of investigation (the wires to the sensor on the transmission were broken off) and some research (on a manual transmission the P0705 is most likely from a failed or damaged - in my case - neutral safety switch).

Some more internet searching uncovered that the ECU is looking for a voltage change from the sensor when the car is travelling more than 30kph (that's 18-ish MPH in 'Murica), and within the last 14 clutch depressions. So I rigged up a momentary contact switch from the leads to the NSS into the cabin. That way I can tap the button a few times while underway to simulate the action of the NSS. It's a kludge but (if it works) it's easier than trying to get to the sensor on the trans while it's in the car. It's hell trying to get a wrench or socket on the NSS while in-car. I'm due for a clutch change soon so I'll deal with it then but I need to pass the test and "get legal" now.

Will this madness EVER end???

PS - On a brighter note, the car is running fine with the stock injectors & ECU. That's a relief because now I know that there's not a systemic problem. I just need to know where in my MS tune my FAIL is. Once I get past this emissions scheiss, I'll move on to Step 2.

Last edited by rwyatt365; 04-18-2014 at 09:54 AM.
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Old 04-21-2014, 10:48 AM   #94
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Update:
Put the 650cc injectors back in and the car ran like crap. So bad even that I reverted to a 6-week old tune that I know ran on the highway (everything else in it was not so good). That at least got me home. I spent the last hour of the day yesterday moving over the accel enrich, cranking and idle settings over into this old tune to create a hybrid that should serve as a baseline for future modifications. I don't know what I screwed up in the last one, but I'll save that analysis for later.

So at this point it's "Two steps back and one step forward".
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Old 04-22-2014, 09:21 AM   #95
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...so I was VEAL-ing yesterday and my old map was being tweaked and I was thinking, "Now we're cooking! I'm getting back on track". I was only cruising around - light throttle, not much boost - when I noticed that the car seemed sluggish. I'm thinking, "Ha, ha, this old tune was REALLY bad but VEAL will take care of THAT!" I wasn't looking at the computer display 'cause it was on the package shelf and I couldn't see it. But when I stopped I noticed that there was NOTHING corrected above 100kPa!!!

WTF????!! Was all of that previous madness because I had somehow borked the turbo? Did I blow out the diaphragm on the wastegate actuator? AM I GOING TO HAVE TO BUY A NEW TURBO?!!!

While the car (and I) cooled down I pulled off the heatshield and immediately saw that the circlip that holds the actuator to the wastegate arm had come off so that the wastegate was always open - therefore no boost. What a relief (kinda, 'cause I was secretly lusting after a 2871).

I called a couple of local "auto parts stores". When I asked about circlips at store #1 - let's call it "O'Smileys" - the guy responded, "What's a circlip?". At store #2 - let's call it "Schlep Boys" - I was put on hold for 5 minutes before I hung up. Store #3 - let's call it "Autobone" - had at least 3 "ASSociates" discussing where circlips might be located in the store before I hung up. That's when I decided to go to the #1 supplier of performance parts in the USofA...Lowes. There I stocked up on the right-sized circlips (which they called "E-Clips") just in case.

Back home, and in 10 minutes the actuator and wastegate were once again connected, and all was right with the world.




FOR NOW
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Old 04-22-2014, 01:38 PM   #96
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Look on the bright side, your wastegate flows enough volume that boost creep won't be an issue
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:52 PM   #97
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Look on the bright side, your wastegate flows enough volume that boost creep won't be an issue
WOW! There's a silver lining in every disaster!!

Now that I've got boost again, I ran VEAL on a trip to the south side of town to visit my sister-in-laws (three of them, here for the week). There are still some tweaks to do on the accel enrich, and I have to manually trim the spark map (again). But I think this will be a keeper.

Maybe now I can start to move onto something a bit more interesting.
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Old 04-28-2014, 12:06 PM   #98
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I did a little experiment this weekend. The reason being that I've pretty much duplicated my old settings (B4 I went down the rat-hole of the crappy highway performance of the past few weeks) and nothing was making sense. What I mean by that is that if I'm almost back to where I was a month ago - barring two differences - then why was the old tune crapping out during steady-state highway cruise but the new tune seems to be just fine. So, one of those two differences is what was causing the problem.

So, what were the two differences?
1. The old tune was using "Include AFR", and the new one wasn't.
2. The old tune was using PID for EGO Control, the new one was using "Simple"

I turned on "Include AFR" and...voila!...the car ran like crap on the highway. Halfway through the trip I pulled over, turned of "Include AFR" and the car ran "like buttah". There was my culprit. I've been running since Friday w/o the accursed "Include AFR" and life is good. I'm sure some of my corresponding settings there are causing the problem, but for now I've got it turned off. The first thing that came to mind was that my fuel and AFR tables are garbage, but when I run VEAL I don't get significant changes (as in the difference plots are mostly white with a bit of pale red or blue) to the VE table. So, I'm counting that as a passable table.


On another front...I did a test-fit of the Nexus 7 tablet in the console. A little bit of Dremel-tailoring and it fit into the double-DIN space of the radio and CD player like a champ. I have to figure out a way to secure the table to the radio surround, but I figure a few well placed clips should take care of that. I've got a few days to get that figured out because my wife - in her latest cleaning binge - managed to "redeploy" the cables and stuff that I was going to use for the tablet install, so it all has to get re-purchased.

For all of you audiophiles out there, look away! Because I'm planning to use the stock Bose amp and speakers - instead of the usual replacement of those with better equipment. Frankly, between the unmuffled exhaust, poly engine mounts and other major NVH things going on, a "quality" sound system is not a priority. All I'm looking for is some additional "noise" of my choice to add to the cacophony!

If I don't get lazy, I'll post pics of the install...
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Old 05-02-2014, 07:55 PM   #99
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Hey, is this you?

I was digging through some deep areas of the hard drive and found some old autocross pictures.

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Old 05-04-2014, 09:42 AM   #100
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Nah...not me. You prolly have shots of me though at Belle Isle - I'm the black guy with the 10AE and (at the time) the homemade "air dam" under the nose. I usually ran #75 or #175 (in yellow - you know "Maize 'n Blue").

I'm no longer in Deeetroit - moved to Hotlanta a year and a half ago. And my car is a cosmetic disaster following a run-in with a Taurus in 2012. I'd post pictures, but I don't want anyone to scream in terror.
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