RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread - Page 7 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Build Threads Building a motor? Post the progress here.

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 06-12-2014, 05:34 PM   #121
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
 
Erat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Detroit
Posts: 4,198
Total Cats: 260
Default

That log looks much better.

I'd use that.

Get it on an actual dyno for numbers. VD is good for an idea, but it was giving me numbers 20hp low.
Erat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 08:43 AM   #122
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

DAMMIT, Dammit, day-umm-it!

Have to put off 'till next week to get to the dyno. Had to clear up some "domestic issues".

DAMMIT!!!

PS - made some more tweaks to the fuel map and the AFR is almost flat between 4700 and 7000. There's a plateau at 11.3 between 4700 and 5600, and another plateau at 11.7 between 5600 and 7000. There's a "lean" spike (12.4) down at 3050 and then a dip to 10.8 at 4200. I'll use the time till next Thursday to get those ironed out.

Tasks for this weekend;
1. Install some Vented Wing Windows from Project-G to try to get more airflow into the cabin (I ain't got no A/C so every little bit helps).

2. Finally get around to installing the Mazdaspeed Comp diff bushings.

3. Replace a temporary bolt/nut on the driveshaft with the OEM bolt (the original nut seized on the bolt - because rust - and had to be cut off).

4. Replace the inner and outer shift boots because old and torn.

5. Clean the engine bay (it looks like crap).

Plans for next week;
- GO TO THE DYNO!!!!!!!
- Replace valve stem seals. The existing ones are 50K miles old.
- Replace timing belt.
- Get rid of the freakin' ugly water neck (I've been running a reroute for years, just never got rid of the neck).
- Replace the front cover seals.

Last edited by rwyatt365; 06-13-2014 at 09:14 AM.
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 12:44 PM   #123
Destroyer of Inconel
iTrader: (37)
 
EO2K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In ur driveway, abusin' ur WPA
Posts: 9,642
Total Cats: 954
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rwyatt365 View Post
. Install some Vented Wing Windows from Project-G to try to get more airflow into the cabin (I ain't got no A/C so every little bit helps).
Please document the pain points when you get around to doing the install. I've been trying to decide if I want to rip my doors apart to do this.
EO2K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 12:53 PM   #124
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EO2K View Post
Please document the pain points when you get around to doing the install. I've been trying to decide if I want to rip my doors apart to do this.
I'll post my "findings"/pic's Sunday (or Monday if I screwed the pooch on this)...
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 12:59 PM   #125
Destroyer of Inconel
iTrader: (37)
 
EO2K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In ur driveway, abusin' ur WPA
Posts: 9,642
Total Cats: 954
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rwyatt365 View Post
I'll post my "findings"/pic's Sunday (or Monday if I screwed the pooch on this)...
Winning! Good luck with the dyno day
EO2K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 05:20 PM   #126
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
 
Erat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Detroit
Posts: 4,198
Total Cats: 260
Default

Make sure to datalog every pull.

They will be better than any street pull you will do, and be consistent.

If the dyno guys are cool, they may let you adjust a fuel and timing a little. It just takes a second to make a few quick changes.
Erat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2014, 09:35 AM   #127
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

Installed the vent windows from ProjectG on Saturday. Things went pretty well, if I must say so myself.

The process;

Take off the door panels and fold back the plastic inner-liner (watch out for the black "dinosaur snot" that holds the liner to the door, I put painter's tape over it to keep from getting it all over everything that touches it).


The instructions say to remove the window glass, but that's not entirely necessary. Just be careful during dis-assembly and re-assembly and you'll be fine.

If you have the access panel (the gold-ish thingy) on the door, you'll have to remove it to get access to the lower part of the guide rail;


Up at the top of the weatherstripping, hidden inside, is a screw that secures the guide rail to the vent window frame. That has to come out;


Then you're gonna have to pry the weather stripping off the corner of junction of the vent window frame and the guide rail. Be gentle but firm, the rubber will stretch but if you tear it, you're screwed and your window will leak forever.

Underneath the weatherstripping is a second screw that secures the guide rail to the vent window frame. That has to come out too;


PS - I have the door off the car, but that's not necessary.

Now you can remove the bolts that secure the guide rail to the door. There's one at the top;



...and one at the bottom;



Now you just have to finesse the guide rail out of the door. Take your time, and it'll be fine;



All that's left is to take the glass out of the weatherstripping and put the new plexiglass back in it's place.

Then comes the infamous "Reverse steps for re-assembly." The only real trick here is to make sure that everything is well lubricated (isn't that ALWAYS the case?). I used a spray bottle of water on the glass/rubber contact patches and WD40 on the metal/rubber contacts.

Re-inserting the window guide rail was the trickiest part. You'll have to start with the window glass halfway up and then have the rubber window seal part-way on the guide rail. Then push the guide rail and rubber between the window glass and vent window while keeping the rubber from pushing back up the rail.

Sounds like you need 3 hands? Well, you almost do 'cause the rubber will want to stick to the window and move up. Liberal lubrication, patience and doing things slowly will get the job done. I also had to jockey the window up and down a few times to get the water to distribute along the window track in the rubber guide so that it would slide more easily.

The first window took about an hour to do (including pic's), the second one got done in about 15 minutes. I didn't take pics of the final product, but I could tell the difference on a short trip around on a 85* Georgia afternoon. And last night it rained pretty good and the ports didn't leak, so I'm pretty pleased. I put a little bit of grease on the port "flappers" 'cause they were a little bit sticky but other than that...so far, so good.

PS - if you're wondering why the door in the pic's is silver but my car is blue/black, it's because I used a "practice door" for the pictures - a door that's intended to go on the shell that I'm eventually going to swap everything into...eventually...
Attached Thumbnails
RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread-20140614_102114.jpg   RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread-20140614_102616.jpg   RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread-20140614_102918.jpg   RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread-20140614_103233.jpg   RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread-20140614_103523.jpg  

RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread-20140614_102651.jpg   RWyatt's "It's takin forever" Build Thread-20140614_104055.jpg  
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2014, 09:55 AM   #128
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default Look away, I'm HIDEOUS!!

I went to a local dyno last night and the good news is I didn't break anything.

The bad news is...my car sucks *****. I only pulled 159 HP and 138 ft-lb. I won't even post up the dyno chart - because fail.

So, it looks like I'm gonna have to do some "surgery" to sort out this limp-dick engine. Time for a leak down test to see where I'm losing compression, and some diagnostics to try to identify why my RPM jitters so much.

I'm putting together a parts list for this rebuild. I'm figuring - at the very least - I'll have to replace the head gasket, hone the cylinders, new rings and lap the valves. This is the absolute, positive bare minimum work. I'm calling this "Stage 0". I figure I can do this for around $300 (reasonable expense).

Stage 1 maintenance items (since I have the engine open);
- Hardline oil return for the turbo (safety precaution since I've already had to replace the rubber water lines).
- Replace timing belt and pulleys (already on-hand)
- New valve seals (the existing ones are original - sue me, I'm lazy)
The incremental cost for this would be about $100 ('cause the valve seals are included in the FM Head Gasket Set, which I would get for Stage 0). Still reasonable.

Stage 2 Upgrades (looking towards the future);
- Manley rods (for insurance in case I get greedy later)
- Supertech valves and springs (sure...why not)
- ATI Super Damper (this just makes sense)
- BE oil pump (protection is a good thing)
I'm estimating $2.5-3K for all of this - out of my ballpark right now.

I could piece this together over time but I don't want to wait for the final product - I want 200 HP and I want it NOW (I'll settle for an honest 180)!!

So, my plan is to do Stage 0 and 1 now, verify my gain and then save up for Stage 2 (and beyond). Then I can do that work when it comes time to perform the "body swap" later.

N'est pas?
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2014, 10:06 AM   #129
Cpt. Slow
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

You're going to surface the head I'm assuming?

Has the compression been checked on the current motor?

Did you do any timing changes on the dyno?

I remember my heart breaking first dyno session like it was last year. Cause it was.

2psi, 3" exhaust, RX-8 injectors, and some timing work, and I've finally gone from a weak 153 to a healthy 185. Can't wait for the 200 mark, but it feels much better than it used to.
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2014, 10:38 AM   #130
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

Head re-surfacing - yes

Compression #'s; 120, 122, 100, 135 (1-4)

No timing changes on dyno. 3 pulls, bang, bang, bang - dyno operator says, "Is something wrong with your car?". Even he was expecting better.
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2014, 10:41 AM   #131
Cpt. Slow
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

Ah, baseline tuning.

Yeah, why'd you go to the dyno with those compression numbers?
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2014, 11:05 AM   #132
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

...to verify whether what I was seeing from Virtual Dyno was "real" (or not) - and to get a point of reference that I could use for comparison going forward.

Edit: I knew it was going to be ugly, but I figured it would only get better from here.
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 03:25 PM   #133
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

"He's making a list, he's checking it twice..."

I'm putting together my list for the stuff needed to "refresh" my engine. I wouldn't call it "built", more like freshened up to get the damned thing up to snuff.

Since my last post I've discovered that the crank pulley had a slight wobble in it, about a 1/16" runout. Two years ago I had to do a Loctite-fix on the keyway (my fault that it got damaged) and it's been solid since then. The jittery RPM signal prompted me to try to see what was going on. One look at the pulley while the engine was running and I was pretty sure I had found the culprit.

So, I squared-up the keyway and re-did the fix. The pulley is better, but not 100%. I've managed to source a low(er) mileage 1.8 short block from a '00 that I'm going to be picking up next week. My only dilemma is whether to put my stuff on the "new" block, or perform a "crankshaft transplant" from the short block into my block (I'm leaning towards the latter). Either way, I figure it's the same amount of work.

Up 'till this discovery, I was having fun trying to perfect my tune. My two goals were;
a) to get the AFR dead-nuts flat between 11.5 and 12.0 on WOT pulls from 2000 RPM, and b) to eliminate a lean spike (and subsequent pig-rich condition) on high TPSdot throttle stabs.

I've just about got "a" taken care of, and I was honing in on "b". But I think all of this fun will have to be postponed until I finish my engine work.


DAMMIT!

One more things...my list-o-goodies includes some new H-beam rods, but there are a couple of other big-ticket items that I'm trying to choose between (because low cash flow); a BE oil pump, or ATI Super Damper. I'm looking for some expert input as to the best short term return-on-investment. Remember, my current power target is just to get near as I can get to 200WHP with my current setup.

So, which one is the better choice? BE, or ATI?
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2014, 05:14 PM   #134
I haz no trubo
iTrader: (2)
 
Oscar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bolton, UK
Posts: 3,021
Total Cats: 114
Default

I'd do the pump. You can always add the damper later without opening up the motor again.
Oscar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2014, 06:35 PM   #135
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
 
Erat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Detroit
Posts: 4,198
Total Cats: 260
Default

Get the new block. Do a refresh. Put some cheap con rods and if the pistons from the old engine looks good maybe use those with new rings? Get the BE street pump. Put it in and run it.

Unless you're going for 8000+ rpms and extended track time with big boost i can't see the damper being that important. I bought one and still haven't installed it yet.
Erat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2014, 12:48 PM   #136
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

...and the answer is...the BE pump by a landslide!

I'm gonna be in DTW next week, so my parts order will go in next Tuesday (don't want too much stuff piling up on my doorstep while I'm out of town - I figure it'll take 2-3 days for most of it to show up).

Current plans are to survive next week, party on the 4th and then get busy the week after;

- strip out and inspect my new/old crank (and either pat myself on the back or cry in my beer over that purchase)
- pull the engine and clean it
- pull the head, strip it and send it for re-surfacing
- pull the pistons and drop the crank
- hone the cylinders, check ring gaps
- retrieve my head, lap the valves and reassemble (re-using the stockers - I know, I know I had springs and retainers on the other list - so I lied)
- put everything together
- WIN!

I could do it all in a couple of long days, but my lovely, wonderful, darling wife would "be concerned" about me putting in long days in the garage.
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2014, 08:56 PM   #137
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

Parts ordered. Let the games begin!
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 01:28 PM   #138
Destroyer of Inconel
iTrader: (37)
 
EO2K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In ur driveway, abusin' ur WPA
Posts: 9,642
Total Cats: 954
Default

Nice! What BE pump did you decide to go for?
EO2K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 04:17 PM   #139
Junior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 49
Total Cats: -2
Default

Good luck on the refresh/moar powerz and thanks for the good laugh about the assorted auto parts supply stores a few pages back.
ahawks9er is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2014, 10:07 PM   #140
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: ATL
Posts: 728
Total Cats: 48
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EO2K View Post
Nice! What BE pump did you decide to go for?
Going simple...getting the street pump w/ no shims. That should fit the bill.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ahawks9er View Post
Good luck on the refresh/moar powerz and thanks for the good laugh about the assorted auto parts supply stores a few pages back.
Thanks. Parts stores are always an adventure in patience.


Going to pick up my "new" short block on Thursday.
rwyatt365 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
OTS Bilstein to motorsports ASN conversion stoves Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain 5 04-21-2016 04:00 PM
WTB MP62 (Hotside) (NB2) Rick02R WTB 3 01-03-2016 08:18 PM
Going back to stock. Need some 1.6 parts. Trent WTB 2 10-01-2015 01:15 PM
Leaky Wilwoods mx592 Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain 1 10-01-2015 01:45 AM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:00 PM.