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Old 03-22-2010, 03:56 PM   #121
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thus is why the founding fathers debated LONG and HARD about what power to allow our govt to actually have.

if they knew what power bulgey eyes had....
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:56 PM   #122
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by this argument we should get rid of government entirely, i've met a few libertarians and i am actually befriended to a few more, but none of them are true libertarians
"True" libertarians != anarchists
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:57 PM   #123
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by this argument we should get rid of government entirely, i've met a few libertarians and i am actually befriended to a few more, but none of them are true libertarians
Correction, by that argument we should stop being such politically correct vaginas and start mowing people down as the try to ILLEGALLY enter the country, stop giving ILLEGAL aliens the rights of US Citizens and ship em back to wherever the hell they're from.

I'm all for immigration, THE CORRECT and LEGAL way.

Political correctness/over-regulation = our nation's financial downfall.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:00 PM   #124
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they are people too :'(
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:02 PM   #125
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they are people too :'(
This just in, the reason Peolsi didn't want to give us time to read the Health Care bill is because not only does it provide free government health care to everyone in the nation, but everyone in the UNIVERSE, we are ALL created equally you know?
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:04 PM   #126
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I'm all for limited gov't, I'm not a libertarian and I find there is a specific necessity for gov't: roads and defense being two. But you cannot deny that the greenbelt pwns all roads in our area.
um..


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Money should be regarded in the highest order. If you think otherwise, then you should start tearing up your paychecks and live off nothing. You don't want to be a hypocrite do you? Oh wait, is it that money is the root of all good?
so you get to apply "limited government" and grey areas to highways and defense, but if you don't consider money to be the end-all-be-all of human existence you should burn all of yours and get bent?
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:07 PM   #127
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The idea that IF you get sick then you start paying someone .00000001% of the costs related to your condition makes absolutely zero logical sense. What business do they have paying for your misfortune? How does this make sense to anyone?
I completely agree, everyone that has a medical disaster should be financially ruined without exception!


:j erkit:
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:10 PM   #128
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I completely agree, everyone that has a medical disaster should be financially ruined without exception!


:j erkit:
Congratulations, you couldn't have misinterpreted what was said more!!!

Insurance, you pay for it, you utilize it when you NEED it and it saves your *** financially while the doctor's still get there's and save your *** medically.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:18 PM   #129
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I find it funny that the percent of Americans that don't have healthcare is almost the same as the percent of Americans that don't have cellphones. The problem with this statistical comparison....the majority of those that don't have cellphones are older, or under the poverty line, and already covered by government health programs.

That means that 10% of Americans CAN afford a cell phone (which none of us had a few years ago), but CAN'T afford this inalienable right called health care?

Seriously, look at your cell phone bill. Now look at your paycheck and see how much your health plan costs per month. If you're unemployed then call around about some private insurance plans.

Priorities people. It is not the government's job to cover your poor prioritization.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:18 PM   #130
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so you get to apply "limited government" and grey areas to highways and defense, but if you don't consider money to be the end-all-be-all of human existence you should burn all of yours and get bent?
Fed should protect our rights, defend our borders and prevent/punish crime. State should do the rest. If I knew my state taxes were going to things like infrastructure and roads and not paying for all the things the Mexicans (this is not racist, there are tons of Mexicans from Mexico in our state) ruin, I'd be happier. Most Libertarians do not even like this view, they want zero government.

I've worked very hard and live well below my means in order to have the money and means I have today. I'd rather not burn it, thanks.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:21 PM   #131
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Our health insurance/care system makes me think of being pressed to death. We have a system that is trying its best to work, but the gubmint keeps piling on huge stones of well-intentioned but poorly thought out regulation. So it works, but at the expense of crushing the system to the point where it's operating at minimal efficiency.

With all due respect to Canada, this health insurance bill (it is not about health care) is just going to be another boulder on the pressing board because it involves subsidies and Ponzi schemes. I'm all for saving people's lives, but it would be a lot cheaper and just as efficient (if not more so) if the system could breathe more freely, so to speak. Almost nothing the gov't subsidizes seems to really work out for the best.

How American Health Care Killed My Father - Magazine - The Atlantic

Good article, and I think it was reasonably well thought out and written. Boiled down: we need less of the regulation and pork that prevents competition in the health insurance and health care systems. Only then will we see prices go down while quality and quantity go up. Regulation for the sake of maintaining quality control and limiting fraud is fine; in fact, that would actually be part of the Fed's job description.

I agree with those who've said that health insurance should be like auto or home insurance; pay for the little things yourself and use the insurance for the big things. It seems like that would make healthcare, overall, cheaper. That would, in turn, actually make it easier for hospitals, ERs, and doctors to treat those who can't pay.

I'm not sure about malpractice, though. On the face of it, it makes sense to place a maximum cap on insurance payouts, but on the other hand, who is the one to determine what the cap amount should be? Maybe it's not so much a problem of malpractice as it is frivolous or fraudulent lawsuits pissing in the pool of valid ones.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:22 PM   #132
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Except people aren't cars. If your wife got cancer and then tried to get insurance, would you still feel that she didn't deserve treatment because it was unprofitable?
I didn't say no treatment. I said no (or reduced) coverage. You sometimes gotta take your lumps. In this case, it's financial. When we were without coverage about 5 years ago (unemployed, we chose not to get it, as it's expensive), I paid out of pocket for her apendix dying. $12k for less than 2 days in the hospital.


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It's unprofitable to you as an individual to be with her too.
Ya got that right. I could afford a lot more if I hadn't married her. Cars, schooling, etc. But love is not logical, hence I pay.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:22 PM   #133
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Well ****, this thread took off in the few hours I was gone. So much, I'm not even going to read the 6 pages I missed Oh yeah

Rabble! Rabble! Rabble!

But seriously, this suxxors
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:26 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by KPLAFIN View Post
Congratulations, you couldn't have misinterpreted what was said more!!!

Insurance, you pay for it, you utilize it when you NEED it and it saves your *** financially while the doctor's still get there's and save your *** medically.
It'd be nice if it worked that way. Instead, 46% of Americans who file for bankruptcy do so because their health insurance didn't save them from financial disaster after a major illness.

Medical bills prompt more than 60 percent of U.S. bankruptcies - CNN.com
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:26 PM   #135
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But seriously, this suxxors


You didnt miss much, only that I'm going to regulate Savington's prices for his brake kit. It's too important to the miata community that we all benefit from his brake kit and it's too expensive. So he now must sell them for 1% over cost. The fact that he wanted to make money on them is rediculous.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:28 PM   #136
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Just found out that my wife's health cost-sharing program was one of three programs that were granted an exemption in the HCR bill, meaning we will NOT have to pay the penalty for not having a traditional health insurance policy on her.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:29 PM   #137
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who has a gun, grab a pitchfork if you dont... We are going to need it.
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:32 PM   #138
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My wife was actually crying last night when she saw that it had passed.

She said she wants to move to Germany....and she's from Mexico!

Last edited by gospeed81; 03-22-2010 at 04:32 PM. Reason: please don't make personal attacks on my wife, this post was supposed to be light-hearted fun
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:32 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
Fed should protect our rights, defend our borders and prevent/punish crime. State should do the rest. If I knew my state taxes were going to things like infrastructure and roads and not paying for all the things the Mexicans (this is not racist, there are tons of Mexicans from Mexico in our state) ruin, I'd be happier. Most Libertarians do not even like this view, they want zero government.

I've worked very hard and live well below my means in order to have the money and means I have today. I'd rather not burn it, thanks.

You missed the point. I think the Fed should protect our rights and borders and do everything else the Constitution says they should, but I consider my life to be a little more important than money. By your words, I should burn all of my money because I don't think it's of the highest order.


This debate would be a lot less headache-inducing if your points were coherent and not sprinkled with gems like "if only NK and Iran knew they could invade and Obama would try diplomacy"
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Old 03-22-2010, 04:37 PM   #140
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So when is the government going to pay for my college tuition damnit?!

lol......
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