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You use the 94-97 RB header in an NA with a VVT swap. We are in "The Definitive 'VVT swap into a 90-97 chassis megathread'" after all. ;)
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Looking for suggestions on how to power the VICS.
I'll be using the fuel injector 12 volts to power the VVT. Is there room on that circuit for the additional load of VVT AND my VICS? Or are you guys using something else? |
e: don't listen to me, i'm bad and dumb
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That's where I would grab it from. I can't see that solenoid taking a huge amount of power. In the '99 chassis, it's on the same circuit as the MAF, EGR valve, and cam/crank sensors. You can also grab it from the ECU if your auxiliary output connector (DB37/etc) has a fused +12v available.
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Injectors should be driven by the same circuit as the fuel pump if I recall correctly. So in any case, the source for that power should be the same. That is where I will be powering mine from anyway (however, will try to run a wire from the F/P fuse to the VVT components).
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6 Attachment(s)
Originally Posted by Lindblad
(Post 1265187)
This is my first reply so bare with me...
My goal is 01 VVT motor swap + EUDM square top manifold + mazdaspeed 6-speed tranny into 95 NA. (Also 94 torsen lsd diff, but am on the fence about the gear ratio) This was written at the beginning of the thread and I have been trying to prove it right. "Fuel system: Use a 1999-2000 fuel rail and a 1990-1993 fuel pressure regulator. No other combination of OEM parts will work. The 90-93 fuel rails are too short, the 94-97 rails have incorrect mounting tabs, and the 01-05 rail places the fuel pressure regulator in a spot which interferes with the cylinder head. The 94-97 FPR places the pressure reference in a spot which interferes with the cylinder head and the 99-05 regulators do not have a return line." Is this only true when retaining the VTCS manifold? I will be using a 99 fuel rail and EUDM square top, and was told from an outside source the 94 FPR should work, so I gave it a try... Attachment 149173 Attachment 149174 It looks like the clearance won't be an issue.. Is there something I am missing or will I have issues with clearance later in the process? The only thing I can think of is I used the 01 injector harness for a fitment test. Am I going to use the 95 injector harness and is this going to cause a clearance issue?? Thanks! :rofl: So I picked up a 90-93 fuel pressure regulator to see if it would be a better fit than the 94 one I was using. I had clearance issues no matter if the 90-93 regulator was right side up or up side down... Pictures are not great as I had my hands full... *Correction* just dawned on me I had read others have had to bend the fitting for clearance... I guess some things are never a bolt on ;) |
I believe you do have to bend that pipe slightly.
Although you could probably get away with just a '99 EUDM fuel rail and FPR. And bend the pipes too. :hatecat: |
If bending the fuel nipple/fitting on the 90-93 regulator is the solution, what methods are you all using to not damage it while bending it? cheers.
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I just used my hands. It doesn't take much strength and you don't need to bend it THAT much...
I was just replacing the fuel lines in my car last weekend again, and you can see the clearance is minimal: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...e/DSC_0105.JPG 99 EUDM FPR points straight down and requires no modification. The inlet pipe needs some bending outwards, just enough that the pipe does not foul on the front of the head and timing covers. This is using a squaretop manifold, unsure if this setup will fit the VICS and VTCS manifolds... |
Originally Posted by ThunderFox
(Post 1282153)
I just used my hands. It doesn't take much strength and you don't need to bend it THAT much...
I was just replacing the fuel lines in my car last weekend again, and you can see the clearance is minimal: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...e/DSC_0105.JPG 99 EUDM FPR points straight down and requires no modification. The inlet pipe needs some bending outwards, just enough that the pipe does not foul on the front of the head and timing covers. This is using a squaretop manifold, unsure if this setup will fit the VICS and VTCS manifolds... Thanks. I am using the EUDM squaretop manifold so it should work out the same. Did you happen to use a dorman 800-081.5 quick disconnect for the fuel rail? |
Alrighty, so...finally finished the thread. Got a question that was tapped on back on the very bottom of page 4 but didn't seem to go anywhere. So here's what I'm working with. I have the entire 2001 car, running and sorta driving. Got t-boned but didn't mess with the drivetrain at all other than a fucked up rear left hub.
So the question, IF I were to take literally everything out, I'm talking dash, wiring harness, trans, rearend...I mean a complete transplant and try to put it in my 91 (after removing all of the same stuff), would it work? My husband and I have done engine swaps before but never a Miata VVT swap. Help would be appreciated guys. |
No Lindblad, I just used regular fuel hose clamps (ABE I think).
JRWeeks, it would definitely work, but you would always have to go the custom way about some details... The wiring loom for the lights on the NBFL is shared with part of the accessory loom so that would have to be modified. Also the NBFL is returnless fuel system, so you would have to adapt one of your existing fuel pipes and plug the other, that is assuming you would not be swapping those and the fuel tank as well. A lot of work for no gains compared to just dropping the engine in and get it some proper management, IMHO. |
JRWeeks: you can do that, and it's your time if you really want to; however, you can spend literally weeks removing the wiring harness and installing the NB2 one... or you can splice half a dozen wires. The 1.6 to VVT swap is well documented and deviating from "the formula" will put you in a spot where the amount of help you can receive is dramatically reduced.
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Originally Posted by JRWeeks
(Post 1283230)
So the question, IF I were to take literally everything out, I'm talking dash, wiring harness, trans, rearend...I mean a complete transplant and try to put it in my 91 (after removing all of the same stuff), would it work?
My husband and I have done engine swaps before but never a Miata VVT swap. Help would be appreciated guys. |
Alright, thanks guys. I figured I would start here as this is the "definitive VVT swap megathread" and there was already a dedicated electrical thread for the harness issue.
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Ok just so the next guy with 90-93 diypnp doesn't have to figure it out them selves.
When switching to 01-04 coils take tach out to 4I inside of the diypnp. Then go to Tach out in TS and turn on. Then as previously documented connect black/white to yellow/blue(the 2 in the middle 4 and 5) at igniter plug |
For those of you who have wired the 01+ coils into the NA coil system:
What order do you have your pins at the 3 prong connector going into the coils? From looking at the mazda diagram, Power, then ground, then signal, is the pin order for the 01+ connectors, descending from the top. Just trying to check that my wiring is correct before I dig deeper. EDIT: A = 12V, B = ground, C = trigger. |
So what is everyone doing with vacuum lines? Deleting everything possible, including charcoal canister, other than essentials - brake booster, MAP line, and FPR? Keep charcoal canister and route it to play nice with NB manifold? Also, what is the function of the the two short lines each running between two spots on the VTCS manifold? I assume they can be kept.
Also, for the fuel lines, is everyone just removing the quick disconnect fitting from the 99 rail and putting the plain NA style fuel hose over the tube with a clamp? I haven't had a chance to look at the tube under the quick disconnect. |
2 short lines are probably for vtcs.
Fuel line needs a quick disconnect to 5/16 hose Barb, and then fuel line slipped over it. |
Great, thanks. That would be the Dorman 800-081 referenced elsewhere in the thread.
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If you cut the firm-ish line off the OEM plastic fitting, it's barbed underneath. I slip 5/16" fuel hose over that with a hose clamp and I've never had any issues with it.
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Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 1158403)
The Definitive 1990-1997 VVT Swap Megathread.
You will need to retain one of the fuel injection fittings from the 01-05 fuel rail to use as an adapter on the 99-00 fuel rail. I prefer to use a 90* adapter instead of a straight adapter to aid fuel line routing around the alternator.Alternatively, you can use an aftermarket fuel rail and aftermarket fuel pressure regulator. :dealwithit: I have both 2004 fuel rail and 1999 fuel rail and I cant figure out what you mean by retaining the fuel injector fittings from the 2001-05 fuel rail. The fittings look the same to me. Also, doesn't the VVT motor FPR regulate fuel to be @60psi vs 43psi for the 90-93? I'm using 2004 injectors with the 90 fpr, would the decrease on pressure affect the injectors? I am running a ms3 so fuel tuning will be done, obviously. Has anyone added an adjustable FPR? What about this one? http://www.miatacage.com/adjustable-...egulator-90-97 |
1 Attachment(s)
Here is a picture for reference. 2004 fuel rail on top, 1999 with 90 for on bottom. I don't know which fitting from 2001-05 "that needs to be kept" you are taking about. I'm confused
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1451866933 |
What color wire are you guys tapping of the injector harness for the vvt solenoid? Is there a way I can find out which one is the 12v without having the car on?
Could I use a 12v 2amp source from my megasquirt instead? |
I'm referring to the plastic adapter attached to the fuel line that clips onto the fuel rail. You can use an aftermarket adapter too, but the 01-05 rails have a nice 90deg fitting that helps clear the alternator. The decrease in fuel pressure is not an issue, but if you want, you can run an aftermarket adapter.
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Originally Posted by btabor
(Post 1296432)
What color wire are you guys tapping of the injector harness for the vvt solenoid? Is there a way I can find out which one is the 12v without having the car on?
Could I use a 12v 2amp source from my megasquirt instead? |
does the nb IAC valve have polarity?
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Please read the original post in its entirety before asking questions.
Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 1158403)
IAC Valve:
If you are swapping to the 99-05 throttle body to upgrade to the internally routed IAC valve, you will need to swap the pigtails for the TPS and IAC wires. The IAC valve wiring is not sensitive to polarity, so you can simply swap the pigtail without worrying about which wire goes where. |
3 Attachment(s)
Thanks Savington for all the info. I kept the original vvt engine harness and used Deutsch connectors on both ends. I think it will end up working pretty well. Looks stockish
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1452204685 https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1452204685 https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1452204685 |
Awesome info in this thread; it helped me swap a VVT into my to my NB1. I got it started with the stock ECU (small miracle), and I have my MS3 Basic waiting to go in, but I'm not sure which wire to tap on the injector harness for the 12v VVT actuator. I'm using the 2003 injector harness, and I think it's the white wire with the blue stripe. If anyone can tell me for sure before I spice into it, I'd appreciate it!
Thank you! |
Originally Posted by thelarva
(Post 1301121)
Awesome info in this thread; it helped me swap a VVT into my to my NB1. I got it started with the stock ECU (small miracle), and I have my MS3 Basic waiting to go in, but I'm not sure which wire to tap on the injector harness for the 12v VVT actuator. I'm using the 2003 injector harness, and I think it's the white wire with the blue stripe. If anyone can tell me for sure before I spice into it, I'd appreciate it!
Thank you! |
Logically, there is one wire that provides +12v to all four of your injectors. It will be the same color going to all four injectors, so look at a couple of your injector connectors, figure out which wire is shared among them. That's the +12v. :)
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Originally Posted by Ziggo
(Post 1301129)
Blue/white is +12v on the injector harness, it's black/white on the spark harness. I used the spark harness, but I am sure either would work.
Im in the process of doing a 01 vvt w/90k in my 94.. I already droped in the motor this past weekend.. I swap to the 94 na thtottle body to use my org tb plug etc.. Is that ok? Im geting a 99-00 nb fr from my buddy and maybe fpr too..(ps can someone post me pic on how to route the fuel lines, what goes where to where) i have an idea but dont want to do it twice.. I have a vvtuner here at home, i dont have any instructions on where to wire thing up.. I just read this entire thread and seems like im on the right track 👍👍 |
Originally Posted by 1.8-m
(Post 1304224)
(ps can someone post me pic on how to route the fuel lines, what goes where to where)
Feed: rear hard line to fuel rail quick-disconnect fitting Return: FPR to front hard line 5/16" fuel line |
For you guys using MS3, do you enable alternator control in tunerstudio when using the 94-97 alternator? Do I set it to closed loop field control?
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The ECU doesn't control the 94-97 alternator. It has on-board control and doesn't need any input from the ECU. Just plug the 1.6L alternator harness into the 94-97 alternator and don't touch any ECU settings.
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Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 1305749)
The ECU doesn't control the 94-97 alternator. It has on-board control and doesn't need any input from the ECU. Just plug the 1.6L alternator harness into the 94-97 alternator and don't touch any ECU settings.
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I knew the answer at one point but I can't remember anymore. I think the VVT blocks are BSPP and all the older ones are BSPT. That banjo fitting shouldn't work with tapered threads.
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Originally Posted by jpreston
(Post 1314692)
I knew the answer at one point but I can't remember anymore. I think the VVT blocks are BSPP and all the older ones are BSPT. That banjo fitting shouldn't work with tapered threads.
Seems like it would make sense that the VVT blocks have straight threads there for the banjo but I don't know for sure. Also not sure if it makes a non VVT block a no go for adding VVT. maybe straight male thread could be forced in or a light re-tap before shipping it off to the machine shop for bore hone and clean would work. |
I will confirm this tomorrow, but I am almost certain that all of the blocks are tapped BSPP. You can thread any BSPT fitting into a BSPP port.
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in for the answer, because I just bought a VVT head to put on my 94 block.
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here is a post from dorzok on miata.net that helped me out. I started this project months ago and lost track of the fuel pressure and return lines:
Hard lines connected to the tank: front is return rear squirts gas |
I am nearing the end of my swap and I have quite a few hanging grounds off the 1.6 harness on the passeger side of the car near the cylinder head. I am using a square top IM and do not see anywhere immediately obvious to ground these wires. I am thinking to just extend them and ground at the chassis.
What is the accepted "best practice" for this? |
Originally Posted by albumleaf
(Post 1333594)
I am nearing the end of my swap and I have quite a few hanging grounds off the 1.6 harness on the passeger side of the car near the cylinder head. I am using a square top IM and do not see anywhere immediately obvious to ground these wires. I am thinking to just extend them and ground at the chassis.
What is the accepted "best practice" for this? e: To clarify, this is for a 90-93 car. The 94-97 cars use a bolt/stud bracket thingie that bolts to the block and connects to the ECU grounds next to the throttle body, and you can just transfer that over to the 99-05 motor. The NB fastens all the ECU grounds to the intake manifold, so the IM is a good place for them. |
Originally Posted by albumleaf
(Post 1333594)
I am nearing the end of my swap and I have quite a few hanging grounds off the 1.6 harness on the passeger side of the car near the cylinder head. I am using a square top IM and do not see anywhere immediately obvious to ground these wires. I am thinking to just extend them and ground at the chassis.
What is the accepted "best practice" for this? Edit- listen to the smart guy. I changed mine later. |
Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 1333595)
I attach all the ECU grounds to the intake manifold. I typically repurpose one of the EGR studs for this.
e: To clarify, this is for a 90-93 car. The 94-97 cars use a bolt/stud bracket thingie that bolts to the block and connects to the ECU grounds next to the throttle body, and you can just transfer that over to the 99-05 motor. The NB fastens all the ECU grounds to the intake manifold, so the IM is a good place for them. To Ziggo, I may have exaggerated a bit, yes, I am referring to the two ring grounds coming off the harness with the injector connector. |
So, I need some help (admittedly, very explicit hand-holding here) as I don't want to do this twice.
A 6-speed went in with the VVT motor. On the car side, I have the following -two bullet style pins, and two white plugs on the transmission side there are -two white plugs, one black plug with two spades I have seen notes written on MT that you just switch the plugs and it works, but can someone be very explicit about what exactly goes where? I have no clue which is the reverse or neutral switch. Thanks, |
Originally Posted by albumleaf
(Post 1334651)
I have seen notes written on MT that you just switch the plugs and it works, but can someone be very explicit about what exactly goes where? I have no clue which is the reverse or neutral switch. Thanks, To figure out which one is which on the car side, look at your old transmission and do the same thing, then match the connectors up. :party: |
Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 1334686)
Take a multimeter and probe the two connectors. In neutral, one of them will show continuity. That's the neutral switch. In reverse, the other one will show continuity. That's the reverse switch.
To figure out which one is which on the car side, look at your old transmission and do the same thing, then match the connectors up. :party: For reference if anyone is as lazy as I was trying to be, for a NA chassis with a 6 speed going in, the bullet connectors from the car go to the black connector on the trans. I ended up crimping spades where the bullets were and jammed them into the black connector (keep in mind, the connector is tight and you _will_ need to isolate the spades somehow. I used silicone tape). The white ones just plug together and are a non-issue. Got my swap running at the last minute on Saturday to make a cruise Sunday. Beat on the car mercilessly for 250 miles and it was the best. Thanks Savington and everyone who posted information in this thread for the help! |
Originally Posted by albumleaf
(Post 1335164)
Got my swap running at the last minute on Saturday to make a cruise Sunday. Beat on the car mercilessly for 250 miles and it was the best. Thanks Savington and everyone who posted information in this thread for the help!
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Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 1314701)
I will confirm this tomorrow, but I am almost certain that all of the blocks are tapped BSPP. You can thread any BSPT fitting into a BSPP port.
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Just for anyone doing this swap, to reiterate my earlier comments.. Make sure you do the wiring for the coil packs so both wires are long enough to reach both coil packs. An earlier version of the original post had the coil pack wiring colors mixed and my car would start until I switched them on a whim. I just experienced the same thing yesterday helping my friend get his vvt swap car started. I suspect he had a very old printed version of the original post that he was working from, but it doesn't hurt to have the cables long enough just in case.
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Does anyone else have trouble with the hood fitting over the motor? I rub in a couple locations, mostly the throttle body and the VVT solenoid/oil control valve.
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The TB shouldn't rub at all, but yes, the VVT solenoid will brush the hood ever so slightly.
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That's where Blackbird Fabworx lower engine mounts are a plus. I removed the cups from the motor mounts to lower my engine down to clear my hood, but I have a custom hood vent.
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Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 1347525)
The TB shouldn't rub at all, but yes, the VVT solenoid will brush the hood ever so slightly.
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When I say rub, I mean polish. The contact is so slight that the top of the VVT oil line gets shiny. It would not surprise me at all if tolerance stacking between the hood bracing, hood mounts, body, subframe, and motor mounts will cause you to either have or not have this interference based on nothing but random chance.
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Might have been answered already I cant find it but will the 2000+ three wire engine temp sensor run the 1990-1993 dash temp gauge or do I need the separate 1990-1993 gauge sender installed?
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Originally Posted by bbundy
(Post 1350403)
Might have been answered already I cant find it but will the 2000+ three wire engine temp sensor run the 1990-1993 dash temp gauge or do I need the separate 1990-1993 gauge sender installed?
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