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Old 05-06-2015, 11:08 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
oh i dunno on that point--never had a car I could actually test it one. I had my ms3 wired for VSS I just never got around to tapping into the dash cluster to get the signal.

Sounds like something's afoul--quite possibly an issue with the firmware.
I think I'm going to try re-loading the firmware. Something really stupid is happening and no one seems to know why.
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Old 05-08-2015, 01:49 AM   #122
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Unloading screen shots for tomorrow's questions/hopefully answers.
(since my work computer doesn't let me upload this stuff, frustrating)

*edit: Ok, here we go
DIYautotune has these settings posted on the megasquirtpnp website. as you can see, it doesnt tell you which drop down to use (probably irrelevant, but still), but most importantly it doesnt say which bias resistor value to use.


This is how I set up both of them. IS THIS CORRECT DIY?



Here is how the fan control is set up in the unit as it is received:


Now for the fun part (and by fun I mean insanely infuriating). Here is how the 3 settings in Programmable on/off outputs are set up in the unit as it is shipped to buyers:


First off, you can see the and/or settings are way off. would someone be able to please tell us what the correct way to set up each so that the fans ACTUALLY WORK RIGHT????

Next, this is the VSS1 vs vss_ms_1 bullcrap that I was talking about earlier. No matter what I do, any time I set it to VSS1, as soon as I open any other output and then go back to this one, it defaults to vss_ms_1. Which does NOT provide a correct MPH output. What is missing here? Why does this happen?


Lastly, here is the speed and gear sensor settings as it comes with the unit. It's off by one 0 which I've circled below, making the speed reading way wrong/off. I've since fixed this, but ARE ANY OF THE OTHER SETTINGS WRONG TOO?
Attached Thumbnails
The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-ait%2520sensor%2520settings.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-clt%2520sensor%2520settings.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-diy%2520sensor%2520calib%2520and%2520fan%2520tables.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-fan%2520control.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-high%2520current%2520out%25201.png  

The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-pwm%2520out%25202.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-inj%2520out%2520i.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-vss1.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-vss%2520ms%25201.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-speed%2520and%2520gear%2520sensors.png  


Last edited by 18psi; 05-08-2015 at 09:20 AM.
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Old 05-08-2015, 02:10 AM   #123
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On my 99 it's 4000 ppm not 40000.

Here are my settings:


What I don't know is - why can I put in the wheel diameter and yours is greyed out...?
MS3pro module with Franks adapter
Attached Thumbnails
The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-vss.jpg  
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Old 05-08-2015, 02:13 AM   #124
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You are correct sir, I had to fix mine to 4000 to read correctly, the MSM base map from DIY comes with the 40,000, that's why I circled it for others to fix on their tune if they haven't already. Not sure about the diameter, maybe different firmware?


and moar pics for later discussion
*edit: here we go

On the left is how the fuel pump is set up in the MSM base map.
Shouldn't all NB's be set up like on the right? They run unreferenced 60psi, not vac referenced 43.5, or am I again missing something?



Lastly, can someone confirm/deny whether the injector timing table is set up correctly for an MSM? And does it stay the same when switching to bigger injectors? I dont know much about what this table actually does.
Attached Thumbnails
The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-fuel%2520pump%2520stuff.png   The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-injector%2520timing.png  

Last edited by 18psi; 05-08-2015 at 09:23 AM.
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Old 05-08-2015, 03:29 AM   #125
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Quote:
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Not sure about the diameter, maybe different firmware?
Using the latest beta. pre 1.4 beta 14
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Old 05-08-2015, 08:34 AM   #126
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this suggests the cooling fan wont even turn on until: 190F AND above 80mph.

it wont turn back off until the temps drop to 188F and speed < 40mph.
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Old 05-08-2015, 09:24 AM   #127
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The values are all jacked up when it defaults to that stupid setting all on it's own. Ignore the values in the vss_ms_1 shots, since obviously the whole point of this is to figure out why the stupid thing defaults to there, and get it to stop doing it, and use vss1 like I want it to.


Would love for DIY or someone to actually take a look at the settings and tell us all how they're supposed to be set up.

The settings are definitely not right as they are provided to buyers.

Is there an updated base map somewhere that I'm totally missing that addresses all these issues?
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Old 05-08-2015, 09:25 AM   #128
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Quote:
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What I don't know is - why can I put in the wheel diameter and yours is greyed out...?
Maybe because you have gear detection enabled and Vlad doesn't?
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Old 05-08-2015, 09:45 AM   #129
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make your own values that make sense and dont worry about the basemap. :P
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Old 05-08-2015, 09:49 AM   #130
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Looks like I'll have to do that either way, I'm getting no help at all.

Last edited by 18psi; 05-08-2015 at 10:38 AM.
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Old 05-08-2015, 09:52 AM   #131
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Looks like I'll have to do that either way, I'm getting no help at all.
Very poor considering how much the MS3Pro costs.
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Old 05-08-2015, 10:10 AM   #132
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Very poor considering how much the MS3Pro costs.
The term "pro" would certainly indicate a professional product with professional support, while the name of the company shows that it is still very much rooted in the DIY/opensource level of support. Maybe DIY should consider splitting into two business units: one professional with the prices and level of support that goes with that and one for DIYers and fully open source. The way it's run now it will eventually implode.
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Old 05-08-2015, 11:56 AM   #133
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C'mon man, gimmie a break. I was out of town for 2 weeks. If you need urgent help, send an email to my 5 man support team. [email protected]

Bias resistor values are 2490 ohms, which is the default.

The thermistor calibrations are a 1-way flash. If you reopen the dialog box, or open it on a different computer, the reported values are not taken from the ECU.

I don't know why you're showing screen caps of deactivated general purpose outputs.

The VSS PPM should be set to 4,000 (four thousand). I am sorry that yours was set to 40,000. That was likely a fat-finger. Hopefully you were able to see that MPH was off by a factor of 10 and fix it easily.

The cooling fan has its own setup menu and can deactivate based off VSS or TPS if desired. My experience with stock bodied Miatas is you want the fan on as much as possible. Add some ducting and vented hood, that changes.

The fuel pump settings were intended for vehicles that have logic controlled fuel pumps beyond basic on/off. Many Fords for instance PWM the fuel pump to control fuel rail pressure in a closed loop system (there is no mechanical regulator as used in Miatas), and other cars like Toyota, Subaru, and even some newer Mazdas have multi speed fuel pumps. If you set the pressure reference to static, the ECU will increase injector PW based off differential pressure. The base map was not set up with this in mind, so if you make this change, you are likely to need a completely new fuel map. I wouldn't do it -- there's no need.

Dude if you feel like you need some answers, [email protected]. 5 guys monitor that email, 5 days a week. We do our best to monitor forums, but it's not easy. MiataTurbo has always been one that I've tried to support personally, but as the company grows (and my family grows), I have less and less time to do so.
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Old 05-08-2015, 12:00 PM   #134
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These are the AIT settings I used, if it helps.

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The 18psi MS PNP-Pro questions thread (Attention DIYAutotune)-factory%2520ait%2520values_zps6vzafle7.jpg  
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Old 05-08-2015, 12:05 PM   #135
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Ben, I must admit that I was/am getting a bit frustrated, mainly because when I was reading the ad for this unit it made it sound like it was completely ironed out and tested to be working flawless over a period of 2 years on a real deal car and not just a test bench.

I'll tone down the frustration. I'll also make sure to direct any time sensitive qustions to the email you posted, thank you for that.

Thank you for confirming that the calibrations I posted for CLT and AIT are correct. Now I can "lock" them and not worry about them anymore.

Thank you for clarifying the fuel pump question, that's also very helpful and now I don't have to worry about that.

The issue with the VSS and Fans - my problem is that they do not turn off with speed, no matter what speed. My understanding was that they should shut off at speed because they're impeding natural airflow past like 40mph. HOWEVER if you're saying this is not the case, then I will leave them alone and not worry about the whole VSS1 vs vss_ms_1 situation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
These are the AIT settings I used, if it helps.

Thanks man, that's with the stock MSM AIT2 sensor right?
what really confuses me is that they're different from what DIY posted. Which ones are the right ones?
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Old 05-08-2015, 12:08 PM   #136
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Vlad, I have my fans on 100% of the time on track, easier to do that then forget to turn them on when I pull in after a session. They're just on a toggle switch, no MS controlled. But after a reroute and ducting, fans being on all the time aren't causing any problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post
Bias resistor values are 2490 ohms, which is the default.
The thermistor calibrations are a 1-way flash. If you reopen the dialog box, or open it on a different computer, the reported values are not taken from the ECU.[/QUOTE]

This is something I figured out on my own, but might help other users to spell it out plainly, just so they're not confused when they see different values every time. Like Vlad.

Quote:
The VSS PPM should be set to 4,000 (four thousand). I am sorry that yours was set to 40,000. That was likely a fat-finger. Hopefully you were able to see that MPH was off by a factor of 10 and fix it easily.
Nope, it's in the base map. As soon as you enable VSS1, it defaults to 40,000, not 4,000. Just a simple tweak required in the base map.

Quote:
The fuel pump settings were intended for vehicles that have logic controlled fuel pumps beyond basic on/off. Many Fords for instance PWM the fuel pump to control fuel rail pressure in a closed loop system (there is no mechanical regulator as used in Miatas), and other cars like Toyota, Subaru, and even some newer Mazdas have multi speed fuel pumps. If you set the pressure reference to static, the ECU will increase injector PW based off differential pressure. The base map was not set up with this in mind, so if you make this change, you are likely to need a completely new fuel map. I wouldn't do it -- there's no need.
For this fuel pump stuff on returnless NBs, are you saying changing these settings from the vac referenced 43.5psi to fixed pressure 60psi requires a fueling retune? I'm curious why NA settings were used in the base map for an NB.
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Old 05-08-2015, 12:12 PM   #137
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Thanks man, that's with the stock MSM AIT2 sensor right? What really confuses me is that they're different from what DIY posted. Which ones are the right ones?
I thought I found those values in a thread you posted in. I probably shouldn't give them to you anyways, they didn't end up working on the dyno, we threw a GM AIT and used it's values, since the Mazda AIT was reading a static temp and was throwing off our fuel curve drastically. Bottom line, use a GM AIT.
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Old 05-08-2015, 01:36 PM   #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post
C'mon man, gimmie a break. I was out of town for 2 weeks. If you need urgent help, send an email to my 5 man support team. [email protected]

Bias resistor values are 2490 ohms, which is the default.

The thermistor calibrations are a 1-way flash. If you reopen the dialog box, or open it on a different computer, the reported values are not taken from the ECU.

I don't know why you're showing screen caps of deactivated general purpose outputs.

The VSS PPM should be set to 4,000 (four thousand). I am sorry that yours was set to 40,000. That was likely a fat-finger. Hopefully you were able to see that MPH was off by a factor of 10 and fix it easily.

The cooling fan has its own setup menu and can deactivate based off VSS or TPS if desired. My experience with stock bodied Miatas is you want the fan on as much as possible. Add some ducting and vented hood, that changes.

The fuel pump settings were intended for vehicles that have logic controlled fuel pumps beyond basic on/off. Many Fords for instance PWM the fuel pump to control fuel rail pressure in a closed loop system (there is no mechanical regulator as used in Miatas), and other cars like Toyota, Subaru, and even some newer Mazdas have multi speed fuel pumps. If you set the pressure reference to static, the ECU will increase injector PW based off differential pressure. The base map was not set up with this in mind, so if you make this change, you are likely to need a completely new fuel map. I wouldn't do it -- there's no need.
If it's a PnP device specifically for the Miata/MX5 then why is PWM fuel pump control even enabled in the basemap?

And not a gripe at you, but the cooling fan thing is one of my frustrations with MS. There are 2 places you can potentially configure it. that makes zero sense. If the output being used for the fan is in use elsewhere it shouldn't be available in the programmable outputs screen.
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Old 05-08-2015, 02:09 PM   #139
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I always control the a/c fan only in the fan control screen, then the main fan in the programmable outputs. that way they can work independently of each other and the a/c fan can be used as a staged cooling fan.
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Old 05-08-2015, 02:21 PM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
Ben, I must admit that I was/am getting a bit frustrated, mainly because when I was reading the ad for this unit it made it sound like it was completely ironed out and tested to be working flawless over a period of 2 years on a real deal car and not just a test bench.

I'll tone down the frustration. I'll also make sure to direct any time sensitive qustions to the email you posted, thank you for that.
It's all good man. The ECU was tested on multiple vehicles over a couple years before being released. The hardware is top notch.

Quote:
The issue with the VSS and Fans - my problem is that they do not turn off with speed, no matter what speed. My understanding was that they should shut off at speed because they're impeding natural airflow past like 40mph. HOWEVER if you're saying this is not the case, then I will leave them alone and not worry about the whole VSS1 vs vss_ms_1 situation.
They should shut off with speed, if that's what you programmed them to do. If you program them under the cooling fan menu to shut off with speed and they don't, there's a software problem we need to fix.
Quote:
Which ones are the right ones?
https://www.miataturbo.net/megasquir...-inputs-82403/
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