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Old 02-24-2014, 07:50 PM   #421
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I have to say, I think that $5k or thereabouts is WAY high for this swap. You'll find a lot of trash talk about people buying a swap kit at $5k, but I think that you're going to play hell actually moving units at that price. While there is some market for people in your position who need a track day reliable ~230whp and the ability to drive to any junkyard in the country and buy a motor for $1500, there are 100 times as many guys who want a K powered street car. I, for one simply wouldn't be able to stomach a $7500 motor swap in a street car.

Hell, before reading this thread I would have laughed in your face if you tried to sell me a stock Miata with a K24 in it with an asking price of what it would cost to buy your kit and a stock K24, a harness, a K-Pro, and a manifold.
So just so I understand, are you saying that creating a product/company that targets the track car crowd is bad business?

I could give you a very long list of successful companies that would disagree.
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Old 02-24-2014, 08:38 PM   #422
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Phht, $10k LS swaps would never be done either...
Just because a rustbucket tub can be had for cheap, why should anyone put a cap on how much money people are willing to pour into the project?

Bring the product to the market and let the primal forces get into play.

Tubular subframes, tubular control arms, drop spindles, spherical bearings, ...
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Old 02-24-2014, 08:39 PM   #423
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Phht, $10k LS swaps would never be done either...
Just because a rustbucket tub can be had for cheap, why should anyone put a cap on how much money people are willing to pour into the project?

Bring the product to the market and let the primal forces get into play.

Tubular subframes, tubular control arms, drop spindles, spherical bearings, ...
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Old 02-24-2014, 10:16 PM   #424
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Can someone school me on hondata? It requires an OEM ECU and doesn't run standalone, right?
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Old 02-24-2014, 10:52 PM   #425
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Hondata K-Pro is a daughter board that goes in the stock ECU. It has a lot of capability because the Honda ECUs are very capable, but it super easy compared to a standalone because its plug 'n' play (obviously).
There is also Flash-PRO which is an OBD-II flasher thing, but I dont think anybody uses that in swapped setups.

I wouldnt give Hondata my money. They stole the work of the community that cracked the Honda OBDI ECU and then took those people to court.

MS3 would do the trick.
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Old 02-25-2014, 12:02 AM   #426
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So just so I understand, are you saying that creating a product/company that targets the track car crowd is bad business?

I could give you a very long list of successful companies that would disagree.
Not at all. I'm saying that there's a much smaller market for Motons than there is for Bilsteins. And a K24 is closer to Bilsteins than it is to Motons.
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Old 02-25-2014, 10:26 AM   #427
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Not at all. I'm saying that there's a much smaller market for Motons than there is for Bilsteins. And a K24 is closer to Bilsteins than it is to Motons.
Your analogy is hard to understand. This swap will appeal to a lot of people. And it's cheaper than a V8 swap and doesn't involve replacing your entire drive train and cutting up your car.

Any swap into a Miata is going to be in this price range if done properly like these guys have and like V8 roadsters did. If you have fabrication skills, equipment at home and lots of time sure you can swap cheaper. But to have high quality parts custom made in small batches it will be more expensive.

Most cheap swaps are butchered nightmares. The quality of the parts in this swap look great and the effort they are putting into it to make sure it suits both the Honda and Mazda community's shows that they are a stand up bunch of guys.
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Old 02-25-2014, 10:52 AM   #428
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Your analogy is hard to understand. This swap will appeal to a lot of people. And it's cheaper than a V8 swap and doesn't involve replacing your entire drive train and cutting up your car.

Any swap into a Miata is going to be in this price range if done properly like these guys have and like V8 roadsters did. If you have fabrication skills, equipment at home and lots of time sure you can swap cheaper. But to have high quality parts custom made in small batches it will be more expensive.

Most cheap swaps are butchered nightmares. The quality of the parts in this swap look great and the effort they are putting into it to make sure it suits both the Honda and Mazda community's shows that they are a stand up bunch of guys.
EXACTLY. You can do anything on the cheap, but we are doing this swap right. Once final product pictures are on the website I think everyone will be very pleased.

A lot of the cost is coming from the fact that we listened to everyone's concerns about keeping the steering rack in the OEM location. A setup like that comes at a price. There are always trade-offs.

We are on the 3rd subframe, 3rd set of mounts, 3rd revision of the adapter plate, 2nd version of the manifold adapter, 2nd flywheel ($$$), 2nd oil pan, and 3rd oil pump.

It would be very, very, very difficult to complete this swap for less cost than picking up our product, let alone the hundreds of hours you would save.
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Old 02-25-2014, 11:09 AM   #429
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I wouldnt give Hondata my money. They stole the work of the community that cracked the Honda OBDI ECU and then took those people to court.

HA!

Yes, Hondata is evil and are the scum of the earth.

SCREW THOSE GUYS!!!
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Old 02-25-2014, 12:33 PM   #430
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Hondata can take my money cause they make a great product lol
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Old 02-25-2014, 01:33 PM   #431
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Immoral business practices aside, a K series ECU with K-Pro usually ends up costing over a grand.
With a setup like this I would want to build a harness anyway, so you might as well go MS3 and save some cash. Hell you could probably buy a K swap harness and put a DB25 on it and call it a day. Might have to extend some of the wiring though.
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Old 02-25-2014, 02:08 PM   #432
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I would love for this to cost under 3K. Better yet 19.95.

But considering the number of LS swapped street cars, I think a 1/2 price alternative with less weight and less work may just be a viable product.

Time will most certainly tell.

I do know that I am one of the cheapest people I know and I am interested. I have thought about an LS swap quite a bit, but always as something I will never do. This I think about and then start looking at how paychecks get divvied up LOL.
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Old 02-27-2014, 06:06 PM   #433
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What sort of header is being designed for the swap? 4-1 or 4-2-1, stepped primaries? megaphone style transition after collector?
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:08 PM   #434
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What sort of header is being designed for the swap? 4-1 or 4-2-1, stepped primaries? megaphone style transition after collector?
Its going to be a ram style 4-1 header, no megaphone due to space constraints.

My goal is for it to be a solid header for 250 whp setups, maybe more. won't know until we dyno it on a built motor.
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Old 02-27-2014, 10:14 PM   #435
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So whats the ETA on the final kit, actually whats the ETA on the oil system, i will be building my own header and working out something other than a s2k intake manifold. I need to sell two more parts at the moment before i can buy. Need a next to new Zex wet kit lol ?
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:02 PM   #436
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So whats the ETA on the final kit, actually whats the ETA on the oil system, i will be building my own header and working out something other than a s2k intake manifold. I need to sell two more parts at the moment before i can buy. Need a next to new Zex wet kit lol ?
Shoot me an email to [email protected] and we can go over the unofficial details on the initial group buy. Cool?
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Old 02-28-2014, 06:44 PM   #437
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4 Piston 2.5L Road Race Engine - K20A.org .:. The K Series Source . Honda / Acura K20a k24a Engine Forum

Just imagine how psychotic this would be in a Miata. Paging BBundy, Savington, etc.
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Old 02-28-2014, 07:35 PM   #438
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4 Piston 2.5L Road Race Engine - K20A.org .:. The K Series Source . Honda / Acura K20a k24a Engine Forum

Just imagine how psychotic this would be in a Miata. Paging BBundy, Savington, etc.
funny, I was just looking at this yesterday. Probably at least 350-375 whp when done.
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Old 02-28-2014, 08:01 PM   #439
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Yeah I was looking at that build too. Nasty for sure. A kraftwerks kit on a nicely prepped k24 would be sweet too
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Old 03-03-2014, 12:41 AM   #440
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My biggest worry is that the stock transmission is still being used. If someone slapped a turbo on the K it would kill all miata trannies. A 500hp K is not too hard to do. I really want to do this and have a K24 in the garage now. Just worry about the trans.
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