Want or do not want? Subaru BRZ STI - Page 22 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 07-23-2012, 04:38 PM   #421
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I mean, it's probably a good platform for a toy. but i want to wait for parts to be cheap and for it to be cheap enough to crash into a telephone pole and rebuilt a new one over the next few weekends and actually make a profit doing it through insurance buy back and selling off un-needed parts.

if im buying a brand new car, that ---- isn't getting touched. I may be ugly, but im not retarded.
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Old 07-23-2012, 06:25 PM   #422
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I may be ugly, but im not retarded.
That's good enough for a signature!
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Old 07-23-2012, 10:39 PM   #423
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Originally Posted by JasonC SBB View Post
Interesting:
- in the midrange it runs DI only
above

- above and below it's both
- above 5000 RPM DI pulse widths drop from ~4 to ~3 ms and port injectors come in at 3.5 ms

I wonder why
Peak TQ just below 5K most likely. If you are running DI only, you have no fuel to pre-ignite even if you have 12.5:1 comp, agressive cams, and lots of heat on crap pump gas.

Once past peak TQ, you dont have the high cylinder pressures so you can use the port injectors to handle some duty and perhaps make life easier on the DI. Even with 12.5:1 and all you wont get issues on pump gas outside of peak pressure areas, so its ok to have fuel coming in any time the intake valve is open.

Or I may be 100% full of ----.....
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:59 AM   #424
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Its really going to depend on dynamic compression ratio and how the heads are cooled. Reverse cooled engines (heads cooled first) can get away with a lot more compression, and if the cams are bleeding off a bunch of compression the DI isnt neccesary.

If it has VVT, id be curios to see if you could use it to bleed off a little compression to make it more boost friendly.

VVT is relatively new to LSxs and GMs so I have a very limited knowledge base on it but I know the turbo cobalt guys where seeing HUGE gains from tunes only, because GM made the VVT system tuneable, and Ive seen the VVT 6.0s pick up 50ft-lbs in the mid range from a tune only.
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Old 07-25-2012, 09:17 AM   #425
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Supposedly the STi version will use a Subaru-developed DI system and do away with Toyota's wonky second set of port injectors.
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Old 07-25-2012, 09:25 AM   #426
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I know the later STi's have dual avcs (basically vvt): both intake and exhaust cam. The WRX and lower models have single avcs on the intake cam. Not sure about the brz, but I hope so, because the difference it makes to torque curve is huge.
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Old 07-27-2012, 07:43 PM   #427
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I has driven one.



its legit. needs about 100 more hp though.
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Old 07-27-2012, 08:02 PM   #428
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
I has driven one.



its legit. needs about 100 more hp though.
What did you think? I thought about trying to get a test drive, still might.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:52 PM   #429
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Originally Posted by Shearhead_3:16 View Post
What did you think? I thought about trying to get a test drive, still might.
definitely a driver's car. Power output felt like my prelude, albeit maybe a little less powerful than the Honda, which is hard to believe

interior is nice, the seats are hella comfortable, and I liked the smaller diameter wheel a lot. Clutch was easy, pedals good to heel toe and shifting was easy. The rear seats are kind of a joke, and this is coming from a prelude owner. The rear vision is limited.

Car looks great in person. impressive styling when you're up on it, I liked the white pearl paint.

I only drove it around the block, it's Gospeed81's brothers new car, so I wasn't going to abuse it, but taking a few corners you can tell it handles well. Extremely flat around the corners and very precise steering inputs. You can have tons of fun with it I think.

It has the feeling of the miata, low power/good handling. I just really thought the output was underwhelming, but my miata has spoiled me. It's an impressive car, I just don't think it's for me.
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Old 07-28-2012, 09:36 AM   #430
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A fair, reasonable, balanced, non-completely negative post (a review, in fact!) from Braineack?!

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Old 07-28-2012, 09:42 AM   #431
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car was slow; it sucks ***.
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Old 07-29-2012, 11:14 PM   #432
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
definitely a driver's car. Power output felt like my prelude, albeit maybe a little less powerful than the Honda, which is hard to believe

interior is nice, the seats are hella comfortable, and I liked the smaller diameter wheel a lot. Clutch was easy, pedals good to heel toe and shifting was easy. The rear seats are kind of a joke, and this is coming from a prelude owner. The rear vision is limited.

Car looks great in person. impressive styling when you're up on it, I liked the white pearl paint.

I only drove it around the block, it's Gospeed81's brothers new car, so I wasn't going to abuse it, but taking a few corners you can tell it handles well. Extremely flat around the corners and very precise steering inputs. You can have tons of fun with it I think.

It has the feeling of the miata, low power/good handling. I just really thought the output was underwhelming, but my miata has spoiled me. It's an impressive car, I just don't think it's for me.
I went and looked at one (did not drive, just looked) and I've got to agree with you, the rear seats might as well not even exist, there was literally no leg room in the one I looked at. I'm not crazy about the front end but the sides and rear of the car look good. The problem is, for the money there are dozens of cars I'd rather have.
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Old 07-30-2012, 10:12 AM   #433
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I think my wife will always be in a coupe herself. So with the miata, I think it would be silly if I got another 2-dr for a DD and end up with three 2-dr cars.

It would be a good car for my wife, but she does go out with friends a lot and it would be worse to stuff people in the rear than the prelude is already. That's a bad negative, coupled with the fact that she doesn't want to drive a subaru or a scion After driving it and checking it out, I'm going to try to stop selling her on it, and stick with the current seleciton we already have on the radar.

I'd consider it for myeslf if we decided she'd get a sedan when/if we replaced her lude, but then I'd hate the lack of power output. We all know that the power output of your motor is directly propotinate to the size of your *****, and if I drove the BRZ it would just send the wrong idea out there. I realize that car carries a lot of momentum, but so does a 300hp/300tq v70r along with a full hatch full of groceries. Maybe the STi verison ends up being a game changer, who knows. But this car is going to be a tuner's wet dream.

I did really like the interior of the genesis coupe, and I think I'd be happy with the v6 model or even the turbo version with some extra boost. But then again, I'd also consider the new mustang if I was looking at coupes.

Right now, the Ford Focus ST is still high on my list, but I fear when I'm ready to buy it will be too soon to get a used on. That leaves me with the Mazdaspeed3 and WRX (I have a thing for these small hatches). I find the WRX too expensive, I'd want at least a 2010 model, and the MS3 is lack luster, but I do really like the styling and the 2012 model can be had hella cheap used. I really don't want to buy new.
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Old 07-30-2012, 10:25 AM   #434
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One reason I'd never own the MS3 or the Fukus ST despite being very decent cars otherwise: FWD.

The torque curve down low will cause you to spin the lower gears, and the topend is weak so once you get going you'll be outa steam.

Which is why the WRX is the clear winner
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Old 07-30-2012, 10:46 AM   #435
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The Fukus wont have that issue. It's electronic steering and has a computer driven anti-torque-steer.

Quote:
the ST will come with a torque-steer compensation scheme using its electronic power-assisted steering (EPAS). When the system senses torque steer, EPAS reacts by varying the torque of the power-assistance motor to dampen out the effects of torque steer. Unlike the trick (and expensive) RevoKnuckle found on the previous Ford Focus RS, torque-steer compensation deals with the symptom and not the cause
Quote:
Under most conditions, torque steer is largely absent thanks to the inclusion of a compensation mechanism that detects the condition and then uses the electric power steering system to counterbalance the phenomenon, curtailing power assist in the direction the steering wheel is normally turned. You can still feel a fair bit of tugging hither and yon accelerating hard out of a tight corner, but it's not hugely pronounced or unnerving. Hau Thai-Tang, Ford's Vice President of Engineering, Global Product Development, tells Autoblog that the Blue Oval has actually intentionally left some of this sensation in – it could have curbed the condition even further through more aggressive tuning. Instead, engineers left in a hint of 10-yard fight as a subtle challenge to drivers – a reminder that they're at the wheel of a powerful, performance-minded machine.
Then it has a traction control system to prevent the wheelspin, plus it has an electronic limited slip diff:

Quote:
The Electronic Stability Programme (ESP) offers three distinct modes – drivers can turn ESP on for a tuned version of the system found throughout the Focus range; a reduced or wide-slip mode disables traction control and activates ESP only when absolutely necessary; and finally, ESP can be switched off altogether.
Quote:
Ford has included an electronic limited-slip differential, which relies on the traction control software to individually brake the front wheel experiencing deteriorating traction, diverting power to the wheel with purchase.
coupled with the jaw-control crap they put on it, testers are saying it feels like a rwd car and you can even get it to rotate the rear out:

Quote:
The new Focus ST also features Torque Vectoring Control (TVC); this applies brake torque to the inner wheel through a corner to reduce under steer. Cornering Under Steer Control (CUSC), applies torque to create yaw torque based on the vehicle’s under steer behaviour prior to ESP, both in power-on and power-off conditions.
Quote:
There's also Cornering Under Steer Control, a bit of code that uses torque to induce yaw and curb plow based on estimates of the car's intended trajectory prior to the stability control system kicking in.




FWD is perferred over RWD for two reasons: 1. snow. 2. if my wife/family/friend ever has to drive it.
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Old 07-30-2012, 10:53 AM   #436
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shearhead_3:16 View Post
I went and looked at one (did not drive, just looked) and I've got to agree with you, the rear seats might as well not even exist, there was literally no leg room in the one I looked at.
FR-S_seating.jpg?t=1335326268
lit·er·al·ly/ˈlitərəlē/

Adverb:

1.In a literal manner or sense; exactly: "the driver took it literally when asked to go straight over the traffic circle".
2.Used to acknowledge that something is not literally true but is used for emphasis or to express strong feeling.

Synonyms:
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Old 07-30-2012, 10:59 AM   #437
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from the position I put the seat, there was 'like' no leg-room And I feel I sit close to the wheel.

But the car is pretty much the miata coupe, so who needs it? amirite?


those seats were fantastic though, oh an onterh thing I didn't like was having to lift up on the shifter-ring thing to get into reverse. and I don't like the push start stuff, but I can get over that.
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Old 07-30-2012, 11:02 AM   #438
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rear seats exist to keep insurance down. whatever that means.

I heard it from a homeless guy who had a sign that was misspelled. he also may not have said that or existed at all.

so I had 5 people nearing or over 6 feet tall in my mini and they were pretty comfortable. for a short trip. now I have an infant seat in there waiting for its occupant to poop out. i put it in the middle position and there is room for a person on each side of it as long as they aren't the size of an average american.
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Old 07-30-2012, 11:03 AM   #439
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Braking to prevent wheel spin.............
You seriously don't see how that is major failAIDS????
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Old 07-30-2012, 11:11 AM   #440
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drive a car with torque vectoring and tell me what you think.

they simply apply a little brake to the inside wheel to push the power to the outside, without the need of a mechanical diff. Wanna know what other cars do this instead of a mechanical diff: The Boxster, 911, 135, McLaren MP4-12C, just to name a few.

I'm going to be driving this car 10 miles a day, with like 3 turns a day.

But I could see this as being an issue on a FWD track car.
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