EPIC nuts/studs loosening thread (reposting stupid stuff without reading = warning) - Page 27 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 07-28-2009, 12:01 PM   #521
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I just started getting the car back together today: the studs cannot be tightened down in the manifold because they simply protrude inside it. Mine have no shank and some say torquing down on the shank is not good either so Im kinda lost here... **** this ****, I am going v-bands.
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Old 07-28-2009, 01:14 PM   #522
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spookyfish View Post
I just started getting the car back together today: the studs cannot be tightened down in the manifold because they simply protrude inside it. Mine have no shank and some say torquing down on the shank is not good either so Im kinda lost here... **** this ****, I am going v-bands.
If I understand you correctly, why not just use resbond to hold them in place? It is a lot cheaper than v-bands and easy to try first.
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Old 07-28-2009, 01:46 PM   #523
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Travis: Wow, that's some small torque. Still, my **** stopped dieing when I went to bigger fasteners, less torque. I probably still have to much but whatever. :-)

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Nice to know that my lathe is still getting a good workout.
Next time you're down in SD, I'll let you see my lathe. Just don't lean too close and get your breath on it.

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Nuts / bolts in a traditional flanged application seem to be a problem in severe duty. Why aren't the v-band crowd having this issue? Surely just as much heat there, and a similar potential for materials to expand against the fastener.
Er, there's a LOT more room for the band to give? And any thermal expansion of the actual joint will merely try to unbend the V, but doesn't pull on the fasteners much.

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gt2860rs (.86AR) clearance phayle:
No kidding. All these "theories" fall apart when you look at the GT2860 - there's no room to do ANYTHING but materials changes.

I had to grind the hell out of the turbo to get my 10 mm studs on there. I'm totally happy I did, mind you.

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Originally Posted by Spookyfish View Post
I just started getting the car back together today: the studs cannot be tightened down in the manifold because they simply protrude inside it. Mine have no shank and some say torquing down on the shank is not good either so Im kinda lost here... **** this ****, I am going v-bands.
Heh, in the past I've fed the nut/stud combo in, and then delocked a second nut to torque it. But my studs poke though. I probably let the shank "kiss' the turbo when there is one.
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Old 07-28-2009, 03:28 PM   #524
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Originally Posted by ZX-Tex View Post
If I understand you correctly, why not just use resbond to hold them in place? It is a lot cheaper than v-bands and easy to try first.
Resbond is a thread locker, not a welding solution. I don't have the smallest faith that that will hold up, as I can wiggle the stud in the thread while the Resbond is drying.
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Old 07-28-2009, 03:39 PM   #525
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post

Nuts / bolts in a traditional flanged application seem to be a problem in severe duty. Why aren't the v-band crowd having this issue? Surely just as much heat there, and a similar potential for materials to expand against the fastener.
I don't think anyone's used v-bands on a Miata yet. A couple cars in the build phase, a bunch more in the planning phase, but nobody has executed yet. I think I'm closest, so we'll know when I track it on the 15th.
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Old 07-28-2009, 03:48 PM   #526
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spookyfish View Post
Resbond is a thread locker, not a welding solution. I don't have the smallest faith that that will hold up, as I can wiggle the stud in the thread while the Resbond is drying.
Edit: this wasn't the case when the MF was new. I just remember that is was quite hard to get the studs in the first time. The MF has suffered alot over the loosening issues over the past few months. So the MF is in a bad shape at this moment. I dont think I will fix this with this manifold.
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Old 07-28-2009, 09:01 PM   #527
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You have upsized studs?
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Old 07-29-2009, 02:37 AM   #528
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ITHe torque with my hardware will be 18-25 foot lbs. I will be using the rod-length method to see how much it takes to meet the actual pre-load.
Is the torque spec with graphite or moly lube, or with Resbond?
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Old 07-29-2009, 02:37 AM   #529
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Its a special grade, I can't give away all the goods. M10 on the flange and M8 on the down pipe. M8 on the flange will work too. Thats just what hustler has.
What about peons like me who still have M8 studs on the mani to turbo flange?
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:54 AM   #530
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spookyfish View Post
Resbond is a thread locker, not a welding solution. I don't have the smallest faith that that will hold up, as I can wiggle the stud in the thread while the Resbond is drying.
I think you should install the turbo and the nuts while the Resbond on the studs is drying.
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Old 07-29-2009, 05:32 AM   #531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonC SBB View Post
Is the torque spec with graphite or moly lube, or with Resbond?
This isn't an engine, it just needs to be tight.

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I think you should install the turbo and the nuts while the Resbond on the studs is drying.
Then I'd be turning the studs all day while wrenching on the nuts.
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Old 07-29-2009, 06:44 PM   #532
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Check out the "quote plus" button. It's pretty sweet. :-P

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What about peons like me who still have M8 studs on the mani to turbo flange?
Replace them. Seriously. It's the best change a normal street use person can make. Solved my problems and believe me, I know stud problems.
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Old 07-29-2009, 07:20 PM   #533
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AbeFM View Post
Check out the "quote plus" button. It's pretty sweet. :-P



Replace them. Seriously. It's the best change a normal street use person can make. Solved my problems and believe me, I know stud problems.
I disagree. I have M8 studs and audi turbo nuts and they've been in place for years.
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Old 07-29-2009, 09:08 PM   #534
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I'm only saying if you're having problems, consider it. I'm certainly NOT saying if it ain't broke, fix it. :-) I've got plenty of pics showing all the various breakages, retapping, etc etc I've done, and only one thing ever really lasted more than 4 months ever - and that was this, which has lasted over a year. I know it'll fix the problem for most people. I don't have any clue how it'll perform on the track (and don't recommend it for that) and I can't imagine in any way it'll outperform a system which is working perfectly. In no way will putting bigger studs make a turbo which stays on stay on "more", it won't do your laundry, blow you, or any such thing. But, feel free to disagree with it, and feel free not to try it. But if you ARE tired of your turbo falling off, I would suggest that you do.
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Old 08-03-2009, 10:10 PM   #535
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We had to import the material for the studs, and custom machine them in house. Will have them soon, and will know price when I get the bill.
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Old 08-04-2009, 12:51 AM   #536
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travis, scratch me from the plan. I converted to the turbo-tim school of logic. Sorry man, I'm going for the definite ****.
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Old 08-04-2009, 01:01 AM   #537
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Travis, I am putting together a customer car next week and I'd rather do it right the first time since he will be tracking it. I sent you a PM, but I want a set of hardware provided the price is semi-reasonable.
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Old 08-04-2009, 01:24 AM   #538
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Travis, are you guys cutting the threads in house?
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Old 08-04-2009, 02:03 AM   #539
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Yea, we cut the threads right here.

I seen your post Sav, I just didn't have an update on it yet. As soon as I get the fasteners done I'll let you guys know.
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Old 08-04-2009, 02:36 AM   #540
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No worries, just keep me posted.
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