EPIC nuts/studs loosening thread (reposting stupid stuff without reading = warning) - Page 47 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 10-26-2009, 05:21 PM   #921
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neogenesis2004 View Post
Its M10x1.25 Trey.
where does everyone get these from? ATP and google can't seem to locate them. It looks like I must pay mazda prices for this ****.
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Old 10-26-2009, 05:23 PM   #922
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Mcmaster if you don't want to feel like you got raped.
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Old 10-26-2009, 11:37 PM   #923
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V6 Camry exhaust studs are the same thread and I believe approximately the right length. Other apps have different lengths. The Toyota exhaust studs have reverse Torx (E-x) ends so you don't have to do the double nut thing to get them in and out.
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Old 10-27-2009, 12:48 AM   #924
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So is this still not fixed yet?

A286 stud kits for around $150 still.
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Old 10-27-2009, 01:04 AM   #925
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I still have a couple prototype sets of Inconel laying around, but I've shot myself in the foot by convincing everyone I know with this problem to convert to v-bands. :( Earliest I would have results would be November, but I am hopeful that Inconel+resbond+stage8 will hold.
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Old 10-27-2009, 02:02 AM   #926
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
I still have a couple prototype sets of Inconel laying around, but I've shot myself in the foot by convincing everyone I know with this problem to convert to v-bands. :( Earliest I would have results would be November, but I am hopeful that Inconel+resbond+stage8 will hold.
Interested still...
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Old 10-27-2009, 04:26 AM   #927
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Interested still...
Remind me to ship them to you.
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Old 10-27-2009, 04:28 AM   #928
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Remind me to ship them to you.
You got PM, email, and IM!
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Old 12-05-2009, 04:38 PM   #929
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You got PM, email, and IM!
Tell me how this works out.

I'm looking at Rene 41 studs that I can get ahold of. It'll be a b, but should work out.

BTW, would anyone be OK with going to std size fine thread on the turbine to manifold side, if its really close to 10mm? This would obviously be for people who haven't drilled/tapped anything yet for 10mm, and this is mostly FM log mani's I figure...

Inconel would hopefully work. We have titanium and inconel at the shop right now, by some miracle. But, good luck getting someone to make studs out of it...
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Old 12-05-2009, 08:57 PM   #930
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chance91 View Post
Inconel would hopefully work. We have titanium and inconel at the shop right now, by some miracle. But, good luck getting someone to make studs out of it...
We did.
But we need more test data before we are comfortable bringing this product to the market.
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Old 12-05-2009, 09:31 PM   #931
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We did.
But we need more test data before we are comfortable bringing this product to the market.
Sweet. maybe you guys can do something with this 3/4 inch plate we have lying around... oh, just kinding. titanium door hinges ftmfw, btw.

Have you guys looked into Rene-41? I have it on good sources that a fella named Kieth Verges used to use this commonly and reliably in 5/16-24 size for his turbo miata, I suppose with much success. I haven't been able to track him down for comment, but I hope to get ahold of him.

I think the thermal properties, no, I'm pretty certain the thermal properties of Rene-41 will be more desirable, but Inconel should work very well against shearing and stretching.

Where all do you use them on your set?
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Old 12-05-2009, 10:35 PM   #932
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Originally Posted by chance91 View Post
Sweet. maybe you guys can do something with this 3/4 inch plate we have lying around... oh, just kinding. titanium door hinges ftmfw, btw.

Have you guys looked into Rene-41? I have it on good sources that a fella named Kieth Verges used to use this commonly and reliably in 5/16-24 size for his turbo miata, I suppose with much success. I haven't been able to track him down for comment, but I hope to get ahold of him.

I think the thermal properties, no, I'm pretty certain the thermal properties of Rene-41 will be more desirable, but Inconel should work very well against shearing and stretching.

Where all do you use them on your set?
Have not looked into Rene-41 but will, thanks. That name rings a bell... I'll see if I can contact him. Just turbo to manifold for now.
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Old 12-05-2009, 11:11 PM   #933
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashnscar View Post
Have not looked into Rene-41 but will, thanks. That name rings a bell... I'll see if I can contact him. Just turbo to manifold for now.
Those are the main one's I'm doing too. I'm looking at Manifold studs eventually. I also have issues with the Turbine outlet on my Fm it seems...

Rene 41 is truly the ****. Amazing stuff. My supplier has a guy who races turbine engined race boats, that see heat which would make miata's cry, and swears by this stuff. Its just hellatiously hard to find, and comparable to inconel as far as price... Also, consider tricky stuff, like proper necks on the studs to distribute the load properly throughout the stud. This is sort of a given, however.
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Old 12-06-2009, 12:03 AM   #934
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I have been racing turbo Miata for years and as far as I know I am the only person to complete any enduros. Won the NASA Texas enduro overall in 2008 (4 hour) and 3rd overall and first in class in 2009 (8 hour).

First the only manifold that works for me is the Flyin Miata piece. Second I use A-286 3/8-24 bolts to hold the turbo to the manifold and 5/16-24 bolt to hold the downpipe to turbo. Safety wire everything.

I have been trying to establish a spec turbo series but everyone is intent on building a better mousetrap and if anyone wants to build a spec car I'd like to help.

You should have no problem with the manifold to head studs if your manifold design is correct

I have hundreds of hours of track time at race pace with my setup and trust it and have the pace to to be confident that I am using the car hard.

Last edited by kverges; 12-07-2009 at 05:16 PM.
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Old 12-06-2009, 12:33 AM   #935
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Talk to Tim about making spec v-band manifolds. I'm sure he could turn them out fast enough. SM plus $500 in turbo, $1000 in dp/manifold, $200 in injectors, and $700 for MSPNP, plus whatever a tial external waste gate costs and you've got a very capable car. Not terribly expensive either. I couldn't afford it, but still cheap in race car standards.
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Old 12-06-2009, 01:02 AM   #936
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
Talk to Tim about making spec v-band manifolds. I'm sure he could turn them out fast enough. SM plus $500 in turbo, $1000 in dp/manifold, $200 in injectors, and $700 for MSPNP, plus whatever a tial external waste gate costs and you've got a very capable car. Not terribly expensive either. I couldn't afford it, but still cheap in race car standards.
That would be an interesting car. You'd have to change some other SM rules, though. I assume tire/wheel/brake options would need to be adjusted slightly and accordingly due to the increased power/speed. That would really be an interesting class, though, wouldn't it?


Btw, Thanks for the input, Kieth. I'm going to start running around and looking.
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Old 12-06-2009, 02:24 AM   #937
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I think 1.8 brakes would be allowable for 1.6 cars, otherwise I don't think brakes or tires would need to be upgraded otherwise, SM drivers don't use brake nearly as hard as most of us do at HPDE's. We need a tire upgrade from 185's, but 205 street tires are fine for a low boost setup. 205 race rubber should be fine.
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Old 12-06-2009, 06:07 AM   #938
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So, I figured something out for myself, others are welcome to this solution if they so wish, but I'm not looking to go selling a bunch of sets, sorry.

Alloy A286 looks to be the most efficient in my case. I won't be running enough pressure through the turbo to his 1400-1500-1600 temps where Rene-41 or Waspalloy would be best, so the excess cost for said hardware is not needed in my case.

I'm going to be running Std fine thread bolts in place of the turbine-manifold studs, and slightly smaller std fine thread bolts in place of the turbine outlet studs. I will have to notch the Turbine-manifold side of turbo on the two holes where the turbine outlet side is in the way to clear for bolts. So, yes, I do need to significantly cut the turbo's flange for this to work. But, In the long run, it seems A286 bolts+safety wire are about as good as it gets for cost-benefit and longevity.

If anyone wants to know more, feel free to contact me.

Last edited by chance91; 12-07-2009 at 02:06 PM. Reason: Lol's aside...
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Old 02-12-2010, 02:38 AM   #939
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Has anyone tried OEM Nissan RB26DETT turbo studs?

Reason I ask....

I've been in the Skyline tuning scene for a number of years. Back in 2008 I built a RB26 with a friend of mine for his R32. Fully forged internals, pro-cams, p/p heat etc etc. We were running twin GT2860r-5's and ran OEM Nissan studs. They are M10x1.25. We had the car tuned by Eric @ XS Engineering and it made 580AWHP @ 1.8BAR. Never had any issues with turbo studs on the dyno or at the multiple track days he ran after the fact. Yes, I know not "real racing" but it's the only experience I have with it.


After doing a bit of research, apparently they are M10x1.25 Inconel studs and IIRC they run around $8/ea.

I'm thinking I may try these out and see how it goes. No harm in trying since my manifold is m8 right now and I can drill/tap them out to m10 easily. But instead of going 1.5 like many people here its 1.25 (wich over the past few days I've found VERY hard to find quality studs for... even ARP do sent make anything according to the rep I spoke with on the phone.)
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Old 02-12-2010, 03:29 AM   #940
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[QUOTE=falcon;521415]Has anyone tried OEM Nissan RB26DETT turbo studs?


i think it's pretty much figured out. the real reason the bolts were stretching and or breaking was due to direct exposure to the exhaust stream because of a cast manifold design. i personally only had 1 bolt that would ever break over and over. it just so happened it was the one bolt that was open to the exhaust gas so when it would break and fall out, exhaust would shoot out the hole. others i could take out and zero exhaust would escape. i asked around and found out that many others with the same problem had bolts snapping on all locations that saw direct exhaust heat. my other 3 bolts had backed out a few times but despite being of lesser quality, they never broke. and only reason they backed out was because the one bolt had already snapped and was not supporting the turbo properly. now that i did one of the solutions below, they have never backed out or loosened.

so what does all this mean? well, if your running at the track and hard enough to have this problem, there's 3 options.

1. buy an absurdflow setup with all v-band connections.
2. weld the turbo flange to the manifold
3. buy a different manifold that doesn't expose the bolts to the exhaust gas

i did #2. lol #2... i actually welded in the hole where the bolt would always break (top left) and welded the flange across the top and down the left side where the bad bolt hole was. (side facing the frt. of the car) if needed i can easily grind that weld off to remove the turbo. i have 6 events so far without problems. i think spookyfish may have more than i do. he tack welded the bolt heads to the manifold. but i think the problem can still exist if the bolts snap internally due to exposure to the hot exhaust gasses. but so far so good.

solution #1 has been tested as well. works great but is costly.

solution #3 has not been tested yet. i'm sure there's alot of people out there with tubular manifolds that haven't had problems, but those are also the same people that street drive their cars, or don't drive at the track hard enough to encounter this problem in the first place. but i'd like to see someone test my theory out.
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