COP Thread - Page 73 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


DIY Turbo Discussion greddy on a 1.8? homebrew kit?

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-22-2011, 04:22 PM   #1441
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (10)
 
Reverant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 5,440
Total Cats: 198
Default

35V rating at a minimum.
Reverant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 04:23 PM   #1442
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Darlington, UK
Posts: 280
Total Cats: 0
Default

LOL 12V. But the ignition systems can run alot more which I found out the hard way when I was a young boy holding onto a spark plug lead whilst my dad cranked the engine!

Thats why im concerned about the ignition system. The last thing I want is to melt wires because there to thin or get a cap blow up

Thanks Reverant 35V min
ronniebiggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 04:33 PM   #1443
Boost Czar
Thread Starter
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,860
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

Good thing we dont have coils amplifying voltage throughout the rest of our electrical systems

The cap is there to store energy. The larger the cap, the more energy you can store. Think about the large 2 farad caps you pu ton large stereo installs to prevent lights from dimming on bass drops. This is the same idea, the 10,00uF cap is storing a bit of energy between sparks so you always have full voltage at the coils for maximum spark.

The voltage rating has to do with the amount of power you pump through it. You want a good fudge factor so the cap doesn't get too hot and explode. ~14v will be passing through it, if you got a cap rated at 12V, it's possible it will actually explode and fail. Not beause the coils operationg, but because the alternator was pushing more voltage through it than it could handle.
Braineack is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 04:35 PM   #1444
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Darlington, UK
Posts: 280
Total Cats: 0
Default

Thanks for explaining Scott, I see what you mean. So as long as you get higher than the 14V then that should be fine. But the higher the better. So 35V will be fine.
ronniebiggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 04:36 PM   #1445
Destroyer of Inconel
iTrader: (37)
 
EO2K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In ur driveway, abusin' ur WPA
Posts: 9,642
Total Cats: 954
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronniebiggs View Post
Where do you get the 10,000 uF capacitors from? I cant locate them anywhere. Are they supposed to be 12V? I can find 18V 10,000 but thats about all.
Amazon, Mouser, Newark, DigiKey... shipping will suck to the UK but you should be able to find is somewhere on the interwebz. NTE makes the 25v 10k uf I'm using. I can check the PN when I get home. Hell, there is probably a PN buried in this thread
EO2K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 04:38 PM   #1446
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Darlington, UK
Posts: 280
Total Cats: 0
Default

LOL. I started to read this thread then stopped somewhere round page 45. There are 8 suppliers on ebay from the uk. Most are 35V, some are 63V but described as high end audio caps.
ronniebiggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 04:50 PM   #1447
Destroyer of Inconel
iTrader: (37)
 
EO2K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In ur driveway, abusin' ur WPA
Posts: 9,642
Total Cats: 954
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverant View Post
35V rating at a minimum.
Why 35v? System should see 14.8-15v max, unless you bought Braineack's old alternator.
EO2K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 04:58 PM   #1448
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (10)
 
Reverant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 5,440
Total Cats: 198
Default

Surges happen all the time. You want double the voltage rating of what your systems runs, and the next standard voltage after 2*14=28 is 35.
Reverant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2011, 12:55 AM   #1449
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 350
Total Cats: -2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EO2K View Post
The COPS were a little tight to get in, but a whack with the top of my hand seated them just fine. They actually feel secure enough that I don't feel a need to build a hold down plate quite yet.
I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest this may be because the hard plastic flanges on the bottom of the coils are actually wider than the valley in the valve cover. I had to file the sides of mine to get them to fit all the way down. Your Fonzarelli strategy could lead to failboat of its own.
SolarYellow510 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2011, 02:04 AM   #1450
Destroyer of Inconel
iTrader: (37)
 
EO2K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In ur driveway, abusin' ur WPA
Posts: 9,642
Total Cats: 954
Default



...but in all seriousness, its a minor interference fit. "Whack" may be too strong of a word. Direct pressure is enough to seat them nice and snug, and they are not tight enough to warrant busting out a file to take care of right now. The more times I r&r these things the looser they get. I have no illusions that the situation is somewhat less than ideal. I will build some sort of hold-down apparatus in the near future, but it worked fine to get me to work and back today.
EO2K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2011, 04:13 PM   #1451
Senior Member
iTrader: (12)
 
absRTP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 582
Total Cats: 0
Default

I think I found why I cannot make my COPs works....

I have Diamond Toyota 90080-19025 COPs that look exactly like the Denso 90919-02244.

They come from a Camry 1.8L 1998+ or Sienna 3.3L 2004+ ...

... these to cars are 24V cars......

So this might be the reason why they don't work ?!

I've looked to my wiring many times and redid everything twice.

Now, can someone tell me if I can make them work or not.

Thank you
absRTP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2011, 04:25 PM   #1452
Boost Czar
Thread Starter
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,860
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

90080-19015
90080-19023

are documented to work, 19025 doesn't seem like it would be any different.
Braineack is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2011, 04:26 PM   #1453
Senior Member
iTrader: (12)
 
absRTP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 582
Total Cats: 0
Default

but does a COP from a 24V car will work in our 12V car?
absRTP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2011, 04:41 PM   #1454
Boost Czar
Thread Starter
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,860
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

valve or volts?
Braineack is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2011, 04:54 PM   #1455
Senior Member
iTrader: (12)
 
absRTP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 582
Total Cats: 0
Default

**** I'm stupid, ... they are V6 cars, 24 valves, not 24 volts,

So then, I have no idea why they would'nt work on my car...

Maybe the pin out is not the same as the other COP? I can't find anything
absRTP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2011, 05:29 PM   #1456
Boost Czar
Thread Starter
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,860
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

i bet if you send one to Jason...
Braineack is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2011, 05:41 PM   #1457
Senior Member
iTrader: (12)
 
absRTP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 582
Total Cats: 0
Default

is there a way to verify if the pinout is like this?


pin 1 : ground
pin 2 : trigger
pin 3 : tach
pin 4 : 12V


this is exactly how I wired it


I don't know whats might be wrong.

When I put them on the car and I try to start the car, it does crank but no spark
Attached Thumbnails
COP Thread-cop_pins.jpg   COP Thread-1.6l_cop_schematic.jpg  
absRTP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2011, 06:20 PM   #1458
Senior Member
iTrader: (12)
 
absRTP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 582
Total Cats: 0
Default

I found this:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/5180459-post66.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by http://forums.pelicanparts.com/5180459-post66.html;
Another option ... and update on my progress ...

I am forging ahead with Toyota COPs with built-in ignitors.
Toyota #90919-02246 for 3MZFE engines (Kluger in Aus, Highlander in US and other models as well). Picture back in post #45.

I now have 14 units to play with after picking up 8 for $9 each on fleabay.
I have managed to get some more info from Toyota on their wiring diagram ...
wire #1 - earth (12v-)
wire #2 - ignition (12v+)
wire #3 - 5v ignition signal
wire #4 - signal back to ECU to confirm firing (not necessary to use)

Before I was aware that they only use a 5V signal, I tested them at 12V (post #97 in thread "using a coil pack ignition"). Luckily, it doesn't seem to have done them any harm.

I will be using MS-II or new MS-3 as a controller.

The COPs fit nicely into 964 valve covers as far as length is concerned. I need to source a slightly larger soft rubber seal for a gap-free fit. Planning to slice some a/c pipe insulation into rings about 1/4" thick for this.
The lower coils also need to be fixed in place so I will make up a set of retainers that use rocker cover studs or the existing mounting points for the original spark plug lead clips. I'll probably do the same on the top coils just to be safe.
It's a different Toyota COP but the pinout is totally different, +12V, -12V, 5V trigger....
absRTP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2011, 06:45 PM   #1459
Senior Member
iTrader: (12)
 
absRTP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Montreal, Canada
Posts: 582
Total Cats: 0
Default

Ok, I just individualy tested a single COP and it work with the pinout that everybody use.

I think I'll have to look at what's coming out of the megasquirt

Last edited by absRTP; 09-04-2011 at 11:46 PM.
absRTP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2011, 03:30 AM   #1460
Elite Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Lebanon, TN
Posts: 1,668
Total Cats: 63
Default

Ok, I've read this whole tread "I think". I have my COP's (part #19015), with pig tails, weather resistant plugs 4pin but look like little trailer plugs but they'll do, and can solder pretty well. I'm looking in wiring them 2by2. As in two COP's per wire harnes to each OEM coil connector and reverse the plugs on each harness to avoid plugging them in backwards on accident. I'm looking in the capacitors. 35v but running 4 caps with one on each pigtail as close to the COP as possible, the idea is thats where the voltage drop is. But do I need 10000uf for each or can I try ruffly 5000uf for each since it doesn't need to supply all 4 COP's. Bigger capacitors are well bigger and would like to hide the capacitor in the harness. Also who has blown up a 25v? thinking of downsizing the voltage to minimize cap size.

EDIT: This is basically what I'm looking at
Amazon Amazon
TorqueZombie is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
OTS Bilstein to motorsports ASN conversion stoves Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain 5 04-21-2016 04:00 PM
Going back to stock. Need some 1.6 parts. Trent WTB 2 10-01-2015 01:15 PM
Leaky Wilwoods mx592 Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain 1 10-01-2015 01:45 AM
01-05 Fab9 PNP COPs (used) FrankB Miata parts for sale/trade 6 09-30-2015 12:48 PM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:22 AM.